[1. CALL TO ORDER AND ROLL CALL]
[00:00:02]
>> GOOD AFTERNOON, WE'RE GOING TO CALM THE CITY COUNCIL MEETING FOR THE STUDY SESSION FOR THE CITY OF INDIO ON OCTOBER 7, 2020 AT 3:00.
PLEASE LET THE RECORD REFLECT THAT COUNCILMEMBERS ARE PRESENT.
THE OTHER THREE ARE IN THE CHAMBERS.
IF WE COULD RISE FOR THE PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE AND IF OUR CITY ATTORNEY ROXANN DIAZ COULD LEAD US ON THE PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE TO OUR COUNTRY.
WITH THAT WE'LL MOVE ON TO ITEM NUMBER 3 WHICH IS OUR PUBLIC COMMENTS, THIS TIME IS SET ASIDE FOR PUBLIC COMMENTS, GENERAL COMMENTS ARE HELD TO THREE MINUTES MAY BE SUBMITTED TO THE CLERK OR BE ABLE TO CALL IN.
DO WE HAVE ANYBODY THAT WOULD LIKE TO SPEAK ON PUBLIC COMMENTS?
>> I DO NOT HAVE ANY AT THE MOMENT.
>> SO WE HAVE NO ONE SPEAKING ON PUBLIC COMMENTS AT THIS TIME.
WITH NOTHING TO BE READ INTO RECORD, WE'LL MOVE ON TO NUMBER 4.
[4.a. A City Council Study Session to discuss and provide City Council direction on the following (1) Review and discussion of Fees & Charges Report; and (2) Review and discussion of the City’s Short-Term Rental program and proposed amendments to the Short Term Rental Ordinance.]
ONE, REVIEW AND DISCUSS FEES AND CHARGES REPORT REVIEW AND DISCUSS, DISCUSSION OF THE CITY'S SHORT TERM RENTAL PROGRAM AND PROPOSED AMENDMENTS TO THE SHORT TERM RENTAL ORDINANCE.WHO WILL BE HANDLING THIS? MR. SCOTT, FLOOR IS YOURS.
>> THANK YOU, I WON'T KEEP IT FOR VERY LONG.
THIS AFTERNOON W TO DO A STUDY SESSION ON THE TWO TOPICS THAT THE MAYOR JUST READ.
THE FIRST ONE, WE'RE GOING TO DEAL WITH, IS FEES AND CHARGES.
AND THEN FOLLOWING THAT WE'LL TALK ON RENTAL POLICIES.
IT'S CONCEIVABLE THAT THE COMBINATION OF THESE TWO MAY CARRY OVER INTO THE MEETING.
I'VE TALKED TO THE MAYOR AND UNLESS SOMETHING HAPPENS BETWEEN NOW AND THEN WE WOULD PROBABLY JUST CONTINUE AFTER 5:00 AND TRY TO FINISH THESE UP.
YOU'VE GOT A COUNCILMEMBER TRYING TO GET YOUR ATTENTION.
>> WHY CAN'T WE SEE ANYTHING IN THE CHAMBER?
SO WE'RE -- WE WILL START WHEN WE GET TO THE TOPIC I'LL HAVE ANOTHER FEW COMMENTS BUT RIGHT NOW THE FEES AND CHARGES, THE COUNCIL IS AWARE, I WOULD IMAGINE, THAT WE HAVEN'T CHANGED OUR FEES AND CHARGES FOR MANY YEARS.
CITIES ARE ONLY ALLOWED T CHARGE WHAT OUR ACTUAL COSTS ARE.
SO THIS ISN'T A R ENHANCING ISSUE, EXCEPT TO THE EXTENT WE MAY WANT TO UPDATE OUR CHARGES TO MORE ACCURATELY REFLECT OUR ACTUAL COST.
THE CITY COUNCIL WHEN THEY LOOK AT THESE DIFFERENT AND CHARGES AND FOR THE PUBLIC'S INFORMATION, THERE ARE A LONG LIST.
THERE'S PAGES AND PAGES OF DIFFERENT KINDS OF CHARGES THAT A CITY CHARGES FOR SERVICES OF ALL CITIES PROVIDE ALL SORTS OF SERVICES.
NORTH TO DETERMINE WHAT OUR ACTUAL COSTS ARE FOR EACH OF THOSE FUNCTIONS, THE CITY COUNCIL THEN HAS A CHOICE, YOU CAN INCREASE THE CHARGES TO COVER OUR COST, OR YOU COULD DECIDE TO SUBSIDIZE THE CHARGES, WHICH CHARGING LESS THAN ACTUAL COST IS ACTUALLY A FORM OF SUBSIDY.
AND I'M ALWAYS QUICK TO POINT OUT THAT A SUBSIDY OF FEES AND CHARGES MEANS THAT THE GENERAL PUBLIC IS ACTUALLY PICKING UP THE CHARGES.
THAT'S AN OPTION TO NOT CHARGE THE OTHER PRICE BUT THAT'S COMING OUT OF OTHER REVENUE.
THE THIRD OPTION WHICH INVOLVES THE CITY MANAGER AND MY STAFF AS WELL WOULD BE IF YOU LOOKED AT THESE COSTS AND SAID, WELL, WE DON'T WANT TO CHARGE THAT MUCH BUT WE DON'T WANT TO SUBSIDIZE IT, MAYBE THE STAFF CAN LOOK AND SEE IF THERE'S WAYS OF CUTTING DOWN ON OUR COST OF SERVICE SO WE DON'T HAVE TO HAVE A CHARGE THAT'S THAT HIGH.
THERE'S REALLY THREE DIFFERENTLY OPTIONS THAT A CITY HAS WHEN IT COMES TO LOOKING AT FEES AND CHARGES.
AS I SAID IT'S BEAN LONG TIME.
WE'VE HAD GOOD STUDY DONE, CONDUCTED BY THE MBS FIRM.
ROB WILL CONTINUE ON AND CARRY THIS FORWARD.
[00:05:13]
MARK SCOTT -- OKAY, NOW I'M READY.
AS MARK MENTIONED, THE LAST STUDY THAT THE CITY DID WAS IN 2012.
AND THOSE FEES THAT WERE ADOPTED BY THE COUNCIL AT THE TIME, WERE SET TO INCREASE OVER A SIX-MONTH PERIOD, SO THEY WER AND INCREASED DURING THE FISCAL YEAR 2013 WITH THE LAST INCREASE BEING IN JANUARY OF 2014.
AT THE TIME, IF THE COUNCILMEMBERS WERE HERE WILL RECALL, THE ISSUE WAS TO SET AT ABOUT 75% RECOVERY LEVEL.
SINCE THAT TIME, THAT COST RECOVER LEVEL THAT IS FALLEN JUST BELOW 50%.
SO IT'S TIME AGAIN FOR US TO EVALUATE THOSE FEES, DETERMINE HOW MUCH OF THOSE FEES DO YOU WANT TO SET THE LEVEL AND THEREBY NO TO HAVE THOSE COSTS SUBSIDIZED BY OTHER TAX DOLLARS AS MARK SCOTT MENTIONED.
IT'S ALWAYS IMPORTANT BY LAW WE NEED TO MAKE SURE WE'RE NOT RECOVERING MORE COSTS THROUGH THE FEES, I'M SORRY, THE REVENUE THAN THE COST OF THE SERVICES.
SO THERE'S A PRETTY SUBSTANTIAL STUDY THAT'S DONE AND THIS IS THE STUDY THAT WAS AVAILABLE ONLINE.
ORIGINAL STUDY WAS DONE IN 2017-18, THEN THERE WAS AN UPDATE TO THAT.
OUR FEE ANALYSIS WOULD BE BASED ON CURRENT COSTS AND FUNDS.
WE TAKE THAT STUDY VERY SERIOUS AND WE WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT WHEN IT COMES TO OVERHEAD COSTS WE ARE NOT DUPLICATING THOSE EFFORTS.
ALL THOSE FEES AND CHARGES WORK IN CONCERT IF ALL THOSE FEES ARE THE SAME AND WE RECEIVE 100% COST MAINLY, THE FEES ARE SET WHAT THEY SHOULD BE, THERE IS NO EXCESS REVENUE ACCUMULATED BY THE CITY OF INDIO.
IN A CITY E-MAIL THE CITY WAS PROVIDED TWO DOCUMENTS, ONE BEING THE DETAILED FEE SHEET FOR THE COUNCIL TO SEE ALL THE FEES THAT ARE OUT THERE FOR THE CITY AS WELL AS STAFF'S RECOMMENDATIONS AND A COPY OF A SEPARATE STUDY THAT WAS JUST DONE IN THE LAST FEW MONTHS ON AMBULANCE FEES.
HOPEFULLY WE'LL BE ABLE TO COVER THAT TOPIC TONIGHT AS WELL.
JUST TO QUICKLY RUN THROUGH THE WORKING DOCUMENT THAT THE COUNCIL WAS PROVIDED, THAT DOCUMENT LISTS BY DEPARTMENT ALL THE CIT FEES, 14 PAGES, AS I MENTIONED IN MY E-MAIL TO YOU, WE HAVE DECIDED, THE CITY MANAGER HAS DECIDED THAT WE PULLED OUT AND SAFETY FEES FOR RIGHT NOW, BECAUSE THOSE FEES NEED TO BE RESTUDIED ALONGSIDE WHAT -- EVALUATION UPDATE.
THE EVALUATION IS HOW WE DETERMINE THE VALUE OF THE PROJECTS THAT ARE COMING INTO THE CITY AND BASED ON THE PROJECT, TH CHANGE.
SO WE'RE GOING TO TAKE A NEW LOOK AT A NEW STUDY BASED ON CURRENT VALUATION RATES AND LEE ANALYZE THE BUILDING AND SAFETY FEES.
SO THAT PORTION IS A FROM THE REST OF THE FEES THAT ARE BEING PRESENTED TO YOU.
BUT THE REST OF THE FEES INCLUDE FEES FOR FINANCE AND ADMINISTRATION, PLANNING, PUBLIC WORKS, THE FIRE DEPARTMENT, AND THE POLICE DEPARTMENT AND SOME COMMUNITY DEVELOPMENT FEES.
AS I MENTIONED, OUR CURRENT FEES HAVE FALLEN, OUR RECOVERY IS ABOUT 50%, BASED ON THE ROUGH RECOMMENDATIONS THAT HAS BEEN PROVIDED TO YOU IN THE WORKSHEET, THE BLUE AND RED DOCUMENT, YOU WILL SEE IN THIS DOCUMENT A LISTING OF THE FEE.
YOU'LL SEE THAT WHAT THE CURRENT COST RECOVERY LEVEL IS, AND YOU'LL ALSO SEE WHAT THE CURRENT FEE WOULD BE AT 100%.
ON THE FAR RIGHT-HAND SIDE, IN RED YOU'LL SEE PRELIMINARY STAFF'S RECOMMENDATION.
CAN I TELL YOU IF THAT BASED ON THE RECOMMENDATIONS THAT BRINGS THE COST RECOVERY LEVEL UP TO ABOUT 88%.
AND THAT WOULD G ABOUT $2 MILLION MORE IN REVENUE IF THOSE FEES WERE ADOPTED AT THAT LEVEL.
SO WE'RE TALKING SOME SUBSTANTIAL REVENUE ON THE TABLE THAT COULD BE COLLECTED.
I'M HAPPY TO GET INTO SOME DETAIL.
WE DON'T EXPECT ANY DIRECTION FROM THE COUNCIL TONIGHT.
WE'RE REALLY LOOKING F SOME DIRECTION ON WHAT YOU WANT TO SEE THE FEE LEVEL SET AT.
WHEN THE FEES ARE ADOPTED, THEY'LL HAVE TO BE ADOPTED IN A PUBLIC HEARING DURING A REGULAR SCHEDULED MEETING.
AND THE DEVELOPMENT RELATED FEES WE'LL NOT BE ABLE TO PUT INTO APPLICATION OR IMPLEMENTATION FOR 60 DAYS.
SO IF YOU DON'T H SPECIFIC QUESTIONS, I'M GOING TO ASK CHIEF FISH TO COME UP AND TALK A LITTLE BIT ABOUT THE AMBULANCE FEES.
BUT THERE ARE THREE KEY THINGS THAT I DO WANT TO BRING UP FOR YOUR ATTENTION
[00:10:02]
BEFORE WE GET TOO DEEP INTO THE FEE DISCUSSION.ONE IS IN REGARDS TO ADMIN AND FINANCE FEES.
PRESENTED TO YOU IN THE FIRST SHEET UNDER SHORT TERM BUSINESS LICENSES.
IN THAT PARTICULAR SECTION THERE'S BEEN AN INCREASE IN CODE STAFFING TO DEAL WITH -- I KNOW WE'RE ABOUT SHORT TERM RENTALS TONIGHT.
THIS IS KIND OF O WHATEVER DISCUSSION HAPPENS LATER THIS AFTERNOON ON SHORT TERM RENTALS.
UNDER THE CURRENT EXISTING FEE STUDY STAFF WAS ADDED TO THE CODE ENFORCEMENT DEPARTMENT, DIVISION, TO ENHANCE SUPERVISION OF SHORT TERM RENTALS.
AND THAT'S WHY IF YOU LOOK AT THE VERY TOP OF THE SHEET YOU'LL SEE SHORT TERM RENTAL FEES GOING FROM $60 FOR A BUSINESS LICENSE TO $746.
SO THAT'S A SUBSTANTIAL CHANGE THAT I MENTION.
ALL OF THE REST OF THE FEES ARE PRETTY MUCH BASED ON EXISTING STAFFING LEVELS BUT SHORT TERM RENTALS THERE WAS A CHANGE.
THE OTHER THING I WANTED TO MENTION TO YOU IS WITH REGARD TO LONG TERM RESIDENTIAL RENTALS, A SHORT TIME AGO THE CITY MADE SURE THAT LONG TERM RESIDENTIAL RENTALS WERE ADOPTED PROPERLY TO THE CITY APPLICATIONS TO THE FEE AND TAX APPLICATIONS FOR RENTALS.
THAT APPLICATION IS STILL BEING APPLIED TODAY AND I'M HOPING THE COUNCIL WILL RECONSIDER THE APPLICATION, OR BE AWARE OF IT.
IN REGARD TO LONG TERM RENTALS, THE COUNCIL AGREED TO NOT TAX THE FIRST AND SECOND BUSINESS OF THE LONG TERM RENTAL AND THE TAX WOULD ONLY BE APPLIED IF THE INDIVIDUAL HAD THREE OR MORE LONG TERM RENTALS.
I WANT THE COUNCIL TO BE AWARE THAT THE LONGER THEY CONTINUE TO WAIVER THE TAXES ON THE FIRST AND SECOND RENTAL AND I THINK ROXANN WILL BE ABLE TO SPEAK TO THIS, THE HARDER IT FOR YOU TO UNDUE THAT WHAT IS MEANT TO BE A TEMPORARY TAX ADVANTAGE GETTING THOSE BUSINESSES SET UP I SYSTEM.
SO IT PROBABLY WOULD BE WORTHWHILE FOR THE CITY TAX THOSE LONG TERM RENTALS JUST LIKE THEY TAX ANY OTHER BUSINESS.
THE MINIMUM BUSINESS TAX IS $60 A YEAR SO I DON'T THE TAX IMPLICATIONS ARE VERY SIGNIFICANT.
THE OTHER T REGARDS TO LONG TERM RENTALS, COUNCIL AGREED TO WAIVE THE FEE FOR THE FIRST REGISTERED LONG TERM RENTAL.
THAT WAS BASICALLY A WAIVER OF ABOUT $60.
THE CHARGE IS EXPECTED TO GO UP TO GOOD $85.
IF THE COUNCIL WISHES TO WAIVE THE FIRST LONG TERM RENTAL, THAT IS CERTAINLY YOUR PREROGATIVE.
THE OTHER THING I WANTED TO MENTION AS A SIGNIFICANT CHANGE IS IN REGARDS TO CREDIT CARD FEES.
HERE IN THE CITY OF INDIO WE ABSORB THE CREDIT CARD FEES.
WE ABSORB THE COST OF THE CONVENIENCE OF ALLOWING THE RESIDENT TO PAY THROUGH A CREDIT CARD.
HISTORICALLY, IN THE LAST TWO YEARS, THAT MEANS THE CITY HAS BASICALLY EATEN ABOUT $70,000 IN COST.
NOW, WITH COVID, WE PUSHED A LOT OF OUR ACTIVITY ONLINE PAYMENTS.
SO OUR COSTS FOR BASIC OUR LOSS OF REVENUE SO FOR EXAMPLE IF WE ARE COLLECTING $100,000 IN SOMEBODY PAYS THROUGH A CREDIT CARD OR EVEN DEVELOPMENT FEES THROUGH A CREDIT CARD WE'RE BASICALL COLLECTING 97 OR 98% OF THAT FEE.
BECAUSE THE REST WE'RE LOSING THROUGH CREDIT CARD FEES.
SO BUILT INTO THE NEW FEE SCHEDULE IS THE RECOMMENDATION TO PASS THE CREDIT CARD FEES HAVE TO PAY DIRECTLY ON TO THE CUSTOMER.
AND THAT FEE IS -- USUALLY VARIES BETWEEN 1 AND 3%.
IT REALLY DEPENDS ON WHAT TYPE OF CREDIT CARD THEY'RE USING.
TYPICALLY IF THERE'S AN AWARD FEE OF SOME NATURE THERE IS GOING TO BE A HIGHER LEVEL OF CONVENIENCE FEE.
BUILT INTO RECOMMENDATION FROM STAFF IS TO PASS THAT CONVENIENCE FEE USUALLY 1 TO 3% ON TO THOSE INDIVIDUALS THAT ARE USING THEI CARDS.
BASED ON THE TREND THIS YEAR MAINLY BECAUSE OF COVID I'M EXPECTING TO COLLECT -- I'M EXPECTING TO PAY $120,000 IN CONVENIENCE FEES THERE YEAR.
SO THAT'S SOMETHING I'D LIKE YOU TO PLEASE KEEP IN MIND.
AND WITH THAT IF THERE ARE NO SPECIFIC QUESTIONS I'D LIKE TO INVITE CHIEF FISH TO COME UP.
IS THERE ANYTHING COUNCIL WOULD LIKE TO QUESTION? MS. AMITH, GO AHEAD.
>> ROB, THERE A FEE RIGHT NOW WHEN SOMEONE PAYS WITH AN E-CHECK ONLINE?
>> YES, THERE ARE SOME ELECTRONIC CHECK FEES.
AND SO WE WERE HOPING, STAFF WAS HOPING THAT THOSE CONVENIENCE FEES WILL APPLY TO THOSE PAYMENTS AS WELL.
THAT'S UP TO YOU, UP T DISCRETION.
>> WE ARE NOT CHARGING ANY CONVENIENCE FEES BUT WE DO INCUR THEM.
[00:15:05]
>> HOW WOULD YOU KNOW WHAT THE ACTUAL COST IS IF YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT THE BANK IS GOING TO CHARGE US?
>> THEY'RE DICTATED BY THE CARD THEY USE, IT IS A LONG LIST.
BUT ALSO ON THE VALUE THEY'RE PAYING.
THE FEES RANGE 1 TO 3 DEPENDING ON THE CARDS THEY USE AND THAT'S A PROPORTION OF THE TOTAL PAYMENT THAT'S BEING MADE BY THAT PARTICULAR INDIVIDUAL.
>> COULD WE SET UP ZELLE WHICH IS A NO-FEE SERVICE TO PAY?
>> I'M HAPPY TO DO THAT, I CAN LOOK INTO UNION BANK.
>> ZELLE, VENMO, ANY OF THE OTHER TYPES OF SERVICES.
>> SOMETIMES THEY COME IN VAGUE AND IT'S HARD TO KNOW EXACTLY WHAT THE PAYMENTS ARE FOR.
SO WE WANT TO MAKE SURE W HAVE A WAY OF MAKING SURE WE CAN TIE THAT PAYMENT TO WHAT IT WAS, WHAT THE PAYMENT WAS FOR.
>> OKAY, THEN I WANT TO GO BACK A COUPLE OF STEPS BECAUSE YOU RAN THROUGH THAT RATHER QUICKLY.
AS FAR AS THE SHORT T RESIDENTIAL AND LONG TERM RESIDENTIAL LICENSING, IN THIS PROPOSAL DID YOU MENTION THAT THAT WAS BEIN RECOMMENDED TO CHANGE FOR MORE THAN ONE LONG TERM RENTAL?
>> SO THEY COULD CONSIDER WHETHER THEY WANTED TO CONTINUE WAIVING THE TAXES AND THE FEES FOR SOME LONG TERM RENTALS.
>> PERSONALLY, I'D LIKE TO PROPOSE THAT WE KEEP IT AT WHAT IT IS RIGHT NOW UNTIL WE GET THROUGH THIS COVID CRISIS.
I'M NOT SURE AT WHAT POINT WE'RE GOING TO REALLY HASH ALL OF THIS OUT.
AND THEN WE TALKED A L BIT ABOUT AMBULANCES BUT I KNOW CHIEF FISH IS GOING TO COME UP.
I THINK SO I ALSO WANTED TO ASK ON THE SHORT TERM RENTAL PROPOSAL, HOW DID WE FARE COMPARED TO THE OTHER CITIES WITH THAT PROPOSAL?
>> WE'LL DO THAT IN THE NEXT PRESENTATION.
>> MARK MENTIONED THAT'S GOING TO BE COVERED IN THE NEXT SESSION WHEN WE TALK ABOUT SHORT TERM RENTALS, RIGHT AFTER THE FEES.
>> OKAY, OKAY, ALL RIGHT THEN I'M READY FOR CHIEF FISH, THANK YOU.
>> BEFORE CHIEF CAN COMES UP I JUST WANTED TO MENTION THAT NICOLE KISSIM, THE CONSULTANT FROM MBS, SHE'S ONLINE WITH US, SHE HAS AN INTIMATE KNOWLEDGE OF HOW FEES ARE CREATED PARTICULARLY ABOUT OUR FEES WHICH ARE ALL BACKED BY, YOU KNOW, WORK STUDIES, TIME STUDIES SO IT'S VERY DETAILED.
WE'RE GLAD SHE'S HERE AND I WANT YOU TO KNOW SHE'S HERE IN CASE YOU HAVE ANY DIFFICULT QUESTIONS.
>> I THINK SHE POPPED UP FOR A SECOND AND WENT OFF.
WAYMOND, OSCAR, ANYTHING? OKAY.
I HAVE SOME QUESTIONS, I'D RATHER DO AFTER WE GET EVERYTHING OUT.
>> MR. MAYOR, COUNCIL OF, THANK YOU FOR ALLOWING ME TO DISCUSS THIS.
AS ROB MENTIONED, BEFORE YOU IS A SUMMARY OF AN M BS STUDY THAT WE'VE BEEN WORKING ON FOR APPROXIMATELY THE LAST YEAR, VER AMOUNT OF EFFORTS AND DETAIL WENT INTO THIS IN PREPARATION TO GIVE YOU SOME BACKGROUND, THE LAST TIME THE CITY ADOPTED A RESOLUTION ON FEES FOR AMBULANCE SERVICE WAS IN JULY OF 2010, SO IT'S BEEN OVER TEN YEARS SINCE IT WA LAST EVALUATED.
CURRENTLY AS DETAILED IN THE REPORT, OUR FEES FALL FAR BEHIND NOT ONLY OUR ACTUAL COST BUT ALSO WHAT NEIGHBORING COMMUNITIES AND KIND OF THE BASE MEAN LINE OF SERVICE LEVEL EXPENDITURE IS FOR -- OR COST, EXCUSE ME, FOR MOST OF LIKE SERVICES THROUGHOUT NOT JUST OUR LOCAL COMMUNITY BUT ALSO REGIONALLY IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA.
WITH THAT, I'LL STAY BRIEF SO YOU CAN ASK ANY SPECIFIC QUESTIONS IS BUT WHAT I WOULD BRING YOUR ATTENTION TO TABLE NUMBER 2012 WITHIN THE REPORT, IT'S MY RECOMMENDATION AND I FULLY ENDORSE THE CONCEPT OF COLLECTING AS CLOSE TO 100% OF THE ACTUAL COSTS AS POSSIBLE.
THERE IS A DIFFERENCE BETWEEN WHAT WE BILL AND WHAT WE COLLECT.
A LOT OF THAT HAS TO DO W THE WAY PAYMENTS ARE RECEIVED BY MEDICARE, MEDI-CAL, EXCUSE ME HOW THEY'RE PAID BUT HOW WE RECEIVE THEM.
MANY OF OUR FEES EVEN IF WE CHARGE $1 MILLION PER TRANSPORT, THE FEES ARE CAPPED BY THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT WHAT WE CAN GE FOR REIMBURSEMENTS.
THE LONG TERM, I THINK IT IS WISE FOR US TO COLLECT WHAT TRUE COST IS.
ULTIMATELY THAT DECISION WILL BE THE COUNCIL'S IF THERE'S A CHOICE TO LOWER
[00:20:11]
THOSE FEES.SO WITH THAT, I'LL -- UNLESS ROB HAS SOMETHING ELSE ADD --
>> MAYBE I CAN JUST ADD A KIND OF CITY MANAGER COMMENT TO THAT.
ONE OF THESE DAYS WE'RE GOING TO HAVE SUCH VOLUME ON OUR AMBULANCE DEMAND THAT THE FIRE SERVICE IS GOING TO BE IN HERE ASKING FOR MORE STAFF AND MORE EQUIPMENT.
SO WHEN WE'RE LOOKING AT THIS, WE NEED TO KEEP IN MIND THAT SOMEHOW, WE'RE GOING TO HAVE TO PAY FOR ALL THAT.
AND BELIEVE ME, T AMBULANCE FEES DO NOT PAY THE TOTAL COST OF THE SERVICE BY A LONG SHOT.
>> TO REINFORCE THAT, JUST TO GIVE YOU AN IDEA OF THE ACTUAL BILLS, OF THE ACTUAL FEES WE BILL PATIENTS FOR, WHETHER IT'S INSURANCE OR CMS, WE ONLY COLLECT ABOUT 38 TO 40% OF THAT REVENUE.
AND LONG TERM, IT'S GOING T CONTINUE TO BE A CHALLENGE.
SOME OF THAT IS THE STRUCTURE BY WHICH THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT REIMBURSES OUR SERVICES.
>> IF I MAY, BECAUSE A LARGE PORTION OF OUR DEMOGRAPHIC IS COVERED THROUGH MEDICARE AND MEDI-CAL, MEDI-CAL SETS CEILINGS FOR HOW MANY L THEY'LL BE ABLE TO REIMBURSE.
IN INDIO WE'LL BE LUCKY TO COLLECT 50% OF OUR BILLING.
THAT'S A NATURE OF OUR DEMOGRAPHIC, WE CAN'T AVOID THAT BUT BY INCREASING OUR AMBULANCE RATES IT DOES INCREASE THE AMOUN GET FROM OTHER INSURANCES, EVEN MEDI-CAL AND MEDICAID IN SOME SITUATIONS.
THE FEE STRUCTURE WE'RE PRESENTING TO YOU TODAY IS IN A FORMAT THAT ALLOWS TO US BEST APPLY THOSE RECEIVE INSURANCE BASED REIMBURSEMENTS.
>> LET ME ASK A QUICK QUESTION.
WHEN WE'RE TALKING ABOUT T RAISING OF THE RATES COMPARED TO THE OTHER CITIES, WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT 50% IS IT BECAUSE OF THE CAPS THAT ARE PUT ON IT OR IS IT BECAUSE OF OUR RECOVERY RATE ON PEOPLE THAT ARE ABLE TO PAY ON THAT?
>> THE BALANCE BILLING LANGUAGE IT HAS TO COULD WITH OUR PAYOR MIX.
OUR PAYOR MIX IS WHAT OUR CITIZENS COMPROMISE, PUT THEM INTO A PIE CHART, HOW THEY SPLIT UP AND THE TYPE OF INSURANCE THEY HAVE.
PRIVATE PAYING, PRIVATE INSURANCE, ARE THEY MEDICARE, MEDI-CAL, THOSE DISTRIBUTIONS, SORRY ABOUT THAT, THOSE DISTRIBUTIONS DETERMINE WHAT OUR POTENTIAL REVENUE IS, SIMPLY BECAUSE EVEN AGAIN IF WE WER BILL MEDICARE FOR OUR SERVICES AT A 100% REVENUE LEVEL, THEY'RE ONLY GOING TO GO TO THEIR CAP LEVEL AND THEN STOP.
SO IT CAPS OUR ABILITY TO CAPTURE THOSE FULL COSTS.
AND THAT'S ABOUT 76% OF OUR CITIZENRY, BETWEEN MEDICARE AND MEDI-CAL.
>> SO 24% IS PRIVATE PAYOR DOES NOT HAVE INSURANCE BASICALLY?
>> RUNS INTO OTHER PAYMENT SERVICES.
>> PAGE 7 IN THE STUDY YOU'LL SEE SOME COMPARABLE RATES.
YOU'LL SEE COMPARED TO THE RECOMMENDED FEE IN INDIO, AMERICAN MEDICAL RESPONSE, THE RECOMMENDED FEE FOR INDIO IS UP --
>> AND AMR IS ALMOST L 1800, AND THE COVE COMMUNITIES ARE HERE, 1500, THERE ARE COMPARABLES, AND SOME OF THE MILEAG MISCELLANEOUS FEES ARE BASED ON AVERAGES IN THE INDIO, TO BE IN LINE WITH THOSE OTHER COMMUNITIES.
>> ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? MS. AMITH, GO AHEAD.
>> CHIEF, THE NONTRANSPORT FEE IS WHEN ANYONE MAKES A MEDICAL CALL TO 911 FOR SOME REASON CHOOSES NOT TO BE TRANSPORTED TO A HOSPITAL? BUT JUST FOR THE CONVENIENCE OF HAVING THE PARAMEDICS SHOW UP AT THE HOME THAT'S A FEE THAT THEY'RE CHARGED, IS THAT CORRECT? I JUST WANT TO UNDERSTAND THE NONTRANSPORT.
>> IT IS A LITTLE MORE NUANCED THAN THAT.
THE FEE IS DESIGNED SO THAT IF WE, THE MOST COMMON, EASIEST ONE TO GRASP IS SOMEONE CALLS FOR MEDICAL SERVICES, WE ARRIVE A HOUSE, WE PERFORM THE ASSESSMENT WITH ALL OF OUR TOOLS, ALL OF OUR EQUIPMENT.
WE INCUR FEES AND COSTS WITH THAT ASSOCIATED WITH NOT JUST EQUIPMENT MAINTENANCE BUT PATCHES, MEDICINES, NEEDLES, ALL THOSE THINGS WE CARRY.
IF THAT PATIENT BECAUSE OF THE SERVICE WE PROVIDED ELECTS NOT TO GO TO THE
[00:25:02]
HOSPITAL THERE'S STILL COSTS INCURRED BY THE CITY THAT WE BEAR THE RESPONSIBILITY FOR, AND THAT'S WHAT DESIGNED FOR.WE ARRIVED, WE PROVIDED THIS CARE, THIS EXPERTISE, THIS EQUIPMENT, AND WE'RE JUST LOOKING TO MAKE OURSELVES WHOLE ON THAT AREA.
IT DOES ADD UP OVER THE COURSE OF A YEAR.
>> IN YOUR PROPOSAL WE'RE STILL NOT PROPOSING ANYWHERE NEAR 50% RECOVERY?
>> I DON'T -- IT IS MY RECOMMENDATION NOT TO STAY THAT IT HIGH, SIMPLY BECAUSE IN THAT PARTICULAR CASE, I SEE THAT THERE IS A BIFURCATION BETWEEN THE FACT THAT WE ACTUALLY SERVICE ALL THE WAY TO THE HOSPITAL VERSUS A COMPACT PERIOD OF TIME WITH NO TRANSPORT TO THE HOSPITAL.
WHAT I'M REALLY LOOKING FOR IS TO TRY TO OFFSET THE FEE COST FOR EQUIPMENT, AND MEDICAL SUPPLIES.
>> OKAY, AND THEN I HAVE A MUCH DEEPER QUESTION BUT IT'S NOT REALLY FOR YOU.
SO I THINK IT'S DIRECTED MORE TOWARDS CITY MANAGER.
BECAUSE THIS IS S THAT I'VE RAISED MULTIPLE TIMES AND I REALLY WANT TO GET INTO IT THIS TIME THAT WE'RE CONSIDERING FEES.
AS MR. ROCKWELL MENTIONED, MEDICARE, MEDICAID, FEDERAL CAPS, WE DON'T RECEIVE ANYWHERE NEAR WHAT THE CURRENT FEE IS.
THOSE FEES THAT ARE NOT PAID BECAUSE OF THE CAPS ARE BASICALLY WRITTEN OFF OR CHARGED BACK INTO THE OVERALL ALLOCATION FO FUTURE FEES.
WHICH TO ME, SEEMS LIKE AN INEQUITY, THE WHATEVER PERCENT OF INDIVIDUALS IN OUR COMMUNITY THAT HAVE PRIVATE INSURANCE OR ARE PAYING CASH, ARE PAYING FOR SUBSIDIZING THE FEDERAL AND STATE CAPS.
AND THOSE -- THAT D SEEM RIGHT TO ME.
ANOTHER THING THAT DOESN'T SEEM RIGHT TO ME IS POLICY-WISE, ADMINISTRATION DECIDE ID THAT THEY WERE GOING TO ACCEPT MEDI-CAL AND MEDICAID FEDERAL CAPS AS FULL PAYMENT AND NOT GO AFTER THE INDIVIDUAL FOR TH FEES.
BUT YET WHEN IT COMES TO PRIVATE INSURANCE, DON'T DO THAT.
AND I THINK THAT'S AN INEQUITY AS WELL.
YOU KNOW, INSURANCES HAVE THEIR CAPS ON AMBULANCE.
PERSONALLY I KNOW OUR CALPERS DOES NOT PAY ANYWHERE NEAR THE $1200 OF AMBULANCE FEE.
SO, YOU KNOW, YOU'RE PUTTING THE BURDEN ON THE BACKS OF THE PEOPLE WHO I GUESS ARE BEING PENALIZE ID BECAUSE WE HAVE INSURANCE OR WE TAKE CASH AND WE ARE SUBSIDIZED BY PEOPLE WHO ARE CAPPED BY FEDERAL AND STAT AND MEDICAID.
I'D LIKE TO FIND MORE EQUITABLE APPROACH TO THIS.
AND THAT'S WHY I IT TO YOU CITY MANAGER.
BECAUSE THIS IS A P DECISION THAT WAS MADE IN THE ADMINISTRATION.
IT WAS NEVER DISCUSSED AT COUNCIL LEVEL.
>> YEAH, AND OBVIOUSLY, IT WAS MADE SOME TIME AGO.
YOU KNOW, AS YOU ALL KNOW, THIS IS MY EIGHTH CITY AND I THINK ALL OF THE CITIES FOLLOWED THAT SAME PRACTICE.
I THINK TTYS COMMON PRACTICE IN CALIFORNIA.
SOME CITIES WILL ACCEPT THE FULL VALUE OF PEOPLE'S INSURANCE NO MATTER WHAT IT IS AND THEN WRITE REST.
AND I THINK THAT IT'S TRUE THAT A NUMBER OF HAVE NO INSURANCE, AND JUST DON'T HAVE THE PAY, WORK OUT TERMS THAT OFTEN CONSIST OF WRITING OFF PART OF THE DISCHARGE.
THERE'S GOING TO BE AN INEQUITY ONE WAY OR THE OTHER.
BUT I DON'T THINK THERE'S VERY MANY CITIES THAT DO NOT ACCEPT FULL MEDICARE-MEDI-CAL FEE, AS COVERING THE COST OF THE SERVICE.
I THINK THAT'S THE COMMON PRACTICE.
IN FACT NICOLE MAY KNOW DIFFERENTLY ABOUT THAT.
THERE MAY BE CITIES THAT DO IT DIFFERENTLY AND SHE MAY KNOW AND WE MIGHT CALL UPON HER FOR THAT EXPERTISE IF THE COUNCIL WANTS TO GO INTO THAT DETAIL.
>> WELL, I'M JUST SAYING THAT IF WE'RE GOING TO DO IT FOR FEDERAL AND STATE CAPS, THEN I THINK WE NEED TO DO IT FOR INSURANCE COMPANIES AS WELL.
ACCEPT WHAT THEY PAY AND NOT GO AFTER THE INDIVIDUAL FOR RESIDUAL.
AND, YOU KNOW, INSURANCE PREMIUMS ARE ALREADY ENOUGH, AND THEN TO FIND OUT THAT YOUR INSURANCE FOR THE MONTH WASN'T ENOUGH TO COVER YOUR AMBULANCE BILL AND YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE TO PAY MORE THAN WHAT YOU MONTHLY INSURANCE PREMIUM
[00:30:04]
WAS JUST TO COVER THE REMAINDER.IT'S QUITE A HIT TO MIDDLE INCOME INDIVIDUALS.
AND I THINK IT'S ONE OF THE REASONS WHY SOME OFFER AN AMBULANCE SUBSCRIPTION PROGRAM.
>> WHERE THEY ALLOW YOU -- I DON'T THINK CALFIRE IS PARTICULARLY FOND OF THIS PROGRAM SO I DON'T WANT TO PUT IDEAS IN THE COUNCIL'S HEAD WITHOUT CALLING ON THE CHIEF.
I KNOW IN THE CITY OF INDIAN WELLS THEY DON'T CHARGE ANY AMBULANCE FEES, IT'S INCLUDED IN THEIR OVERALL TAXES.
I WOULD -- MEMBERSHIP OR WHATEVER --
>> I WOULD HAVE ANYTHING TO HAVE THE MONEY THAT INDIAN WELLS HAS.
>> THERE IF YOU WANT TO SIGN UP FOR ANNUAL AMBULANCE FEES WHATEVER YOUR COSTS THEY ARE COVERED.
I REMEMBER IN FRESNO W DID THAT, AT THAT TIME IN THOSE DAYS IT WAS ONLY $4 A MONTH, GOT CHARGED ON MY WATER BILL THAT WAS PAID ON A MONTHLY BASIS.
AND THAT WAY, WHEN YOU HAD AN AMBULANCE CALM COVERED FOR OIT.
AND CUMULATIVELY THROUGHOUT THE COMMUNITY IT WAS ENOUGH TO COVER THE COST.
I SUSPECT IT'S MORE LIKE $10 NOW THAN IT WAS $4 THEN.
BUT THAT'S ONE WAY I T SOME CITIES TRY TO DEAL WITH THAT.
HEY, THEY SAID WE O A POLICY THAT YOU CAN CHOOSE TO FOLLOW.
IF YOU CHOOSE NOT TO FOLLOW OIT THE EQUITY IS ON YOU NOT ON THE CITY.
>> RIGHT, I REALLY WOULD LIKE TO CONSIDER SOMETHING LIKE THAT.
BECAUSE I'M BEING HONEST WITH YOU, THE ONE TIME I HAD A AMBULANCE RIDE, THE RESIDUAL THAT I PAID WAS MORE THAN MY MONTHLY PREMIUM FOR THE INSURANCE.
AND THAT'S A LOT FOR A WORKING PERSON.
THAT'S WHY WE HAVE TO END UP WORKING OUT SO MANY PAYMENTS ON THESE THINGS.
IT IS A VERY INEXACT SCIENCE RIGHT NOW THAT WE USE IN DEALING WITH AMBULANCE FEES.
AND IT'S THAT WAY ALL OVER THE COUNTRY.
DOES NICOLE -- WAVE AT ME IF YOU HAVE ANYTHING TO ADD ON THIS.
>> I JUST WANTED TO MENTION THAT ISSUE BECAUSE IT'S BEEN A LONG STANDING ISSUE FOR ME AND IF YOU COULD TALK TO CALFIRE TO SEE -- I DON'T THINK IT WOULD AFFECT CALFIRE -- IT WOULD THE FINANCE DEPARTMENT THAT WOULD HAVE TO TRACK IT.
>> ARE YOU TALKING MS. AMITH THEN TO COME UP WITH A SOLUTION THAT IS EQUAL OR TRY TO GET MORE MONEY OUT OF THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT AND STATE GOVERNMENT TO PAY FOR --
>> WE'RE NOT GOING TO GET MORE MONEY OUT OF THE FEDS OR THE STATE BUT WE COULD COME UP WITH AN UNDERWRITING PROGRAM THAT PEOPLE CAN CHOOSE TO PARTICIPATE IN, AND WE CAN SELF-SUBSIDIZE IN THE CASES WHERE THE INSURANCE COMPANY DOES NOT COVER THE FULL AMBULANCE FEE.
>> YOU'RE ALREADY SICK AND ALL OF A SUDDEN YOU GET HIT WITH ANOTHER BILL, LIKE THE HOSPITALS, YOU GET A FIVE OR $10,000 BILL AFTER YOU HAVE BEEN OUT SICK FROM WORK FOR TWO MONTHS.
ANYTHING ELSE MS. AMITH? WAYMOND, OSCAR? ELAINE YOU'RE O BELIEVE.
>> WE DID HAVE SOMEBODY THAT WANTED TO SPEAK, I GUESS THEY'RE OFF, IS THAT TRUE? CHIEF, ANYTHING YOU NEED FROM US?
>> NO, I JUST WANTED TO RELATE, I DIDN'T WANT TO INTERRUPT THE COUNCILWOMAN.
ONCE OF THE REASONS I DON'T WANT TO CHARGE 100% OF THAT, I DON'T WANT TO DEINCENTIVIZE PEOPLE THEY NEED TO CALL.
MAKE IT A HEALTH BASED DECISION, FIRST THING WE'RE CONCERNED WITH IS PEOPLE'S HEALTH.
>> WHAT HAPPENS ON A CASE WHERE THEY CALL FOR AN AMBULANCE AND THE OTHER PERSON DOES NOT WANT OR WISH IT, DO THEY STIL RESPONSIBLE FOR THE CALL?
>> NOT IF THERE'S NO TREATMENT.
THAT OFTEN HAPPENS IN THE CASE OF CAR ACCIDENTS.
NOW THERE ARE ALWAYS EXCEPTIONS THAT THESE WEIRD, WONKY SITUATIONS WHERE THINGS JUST KIND OF WORK OUT BUT GENERALLY SPEAKING, SOMEONE HAS A CAR ACCIDENT, THEY SEE IT, THEY INITIATE A 911 CALL.
IF NO SERVICE IS RENDERED WE ARE ESSENTIALLY THERE FOR THE SAKE OF MAKING SURE
[00:35:02]
EVERYBODY IS OKAY, THERE IS NOT USUALLY A FEE ASSOCIATED WITH THAT.AT THE POINT WE START TO EVALUATE, POTENTIALLY TRANSPORT, THAT'S WHEN THE BILLING IS INCURRED.
THE BILLING AGENCY DOES SOME OF THAT VETTING FOR IF THERE'S EVER A DISPUTE FROM THE PAYOR THAT GOES TO THE FINANCE DEPARTMENT AND WE WORK COLLABORATIVELY WITH THE FIRE DEPARTMENT TO EVALUATE WHAT'S APPROPRIATE FOR THAT FEE STRUCTURE.
ANY OTHER QUESTIONS OF THE CHIEF THEN OR ANYTHING? ANYBODY WANT TO HEAR FROM NICOLE ABOUT ANYTHING THAT SHE'S HEARD? OKAY.
>> THE ONLY THING WOULD I ADD, BASED ON THE RECOMMENDED FEE SCHEDULE BY STAFF, I WOULD ONLY BRING IN ABOUT HALF DOLLARS, WE ARE COVERING $2 MILLION NOW AND THIS FEE SCHEDULE WOULD BRING IT UP TO 2.5, MAYBE 2.6 MILLION A YEAR.
WHAT DO YOU NEED FROM US AT THIS TIME, MR. ROCKWELL?
>> WE WANT YOU TO BE COMFORTABLE WITH THE INFORMATION.
IF YOU WANT TO GIVE US SUGGESTIONS WHAT TO BRING BACK TO THE COUNCIL AND ENTERTAIN AT A LATER TIME, NOW WOULD BE A GOO GIVE US THIS INFORMATION.
>> WOULD I LIKE TO SEE A COLUMN ADDED TO THIS ALL DEPARTMENTS FEES, THAT INDICATES A DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THE CURRENT AND THE PROPOSED.
THAT'S THE FIRST SUGGESTION I HAVE.
SECOND SUGGESTION I HAVE IF WE ARE TO CONSIDER ANY INCREASES WOULD I REALLY WANT TO DEFER THIS UNTIL NEXT FISCAL CYCLE.
IT IS NOT SOMETHING WOULD I WANT TO DO NOW GLOBAL PANDEMIC.
MR. FERMON OR MR. ORTIZ, ANY QUESTIONS, ANY COMMENTS OF ANYTHING YOU'D LIKE TO HEAR STAFF OR BRING BACK MR. FERMON?
>> THERE WE GO, I'M ALL OVER THE PLACE ON MY SCREEN.
I WANTED TO SEE COMPARISONS IN OTHER CITY VALLEYS AS FAR AS FEES THAT WE WERE GOING TO GO OVER THAT.
>> THAT IS ACTUALLY IN THE REPORT, SIR.
IT'S A COMPARABLE, A THE PAGE I BELIEVE IS PAGE 6 OR 7 IN THE -- 6, PAGE 6 IN THE REPORT.
IT GIVES NOT JUST THE AMERICAN MEDICAL FOR COUNTY'S CONTRACTED RATES BUT CATHEDRAL CITY, THE COVE COMMUNITIES AS A WHOLE, AND JUST ARTICULATE, THE COVE COMMUNITIES IS REFERRED TO PALM DESERT AND RANCHO MIRAGE AS INDIAN WELLS I BELIEVE IS STILL 100% SUBSIDIZING.
THE OTHER COVE COMMUNITIES USED TO BE 100% SUBSIDIZED AS WELL AND THEY MOVED TOWARDS A FEE STRUCTURE APPROXIMATELY THREE CHEM MAYBE FOUR YEARS AGO.
AND THEN TO GIVE YOU A IDEA OF A LARGE, TWO LARGE SYSTEMS, THERE'S SAN BERNARDINO COUNTY FIRE AND LOS ANGELES COUNTY FIRE TO GIVE YOU A COMPARISON AND HERE LOCALLY MORE REGIONALLY, THES PROGRAMS THAT HAVE BEEN AROUND FOR A NUMBER OF YEARS.
AND THE REASON TO DO THAT IS I'D POINT OUT THAT LOS ANGELES COUNTY IS CHARGING ALMOST $2300 PER TRANSPORT.
SO EVEN AT 100% RECOVERY RATE, SOME OF THAT WITH THE STRUCTURE OF THEIR OVERALL SYSTEM AND THE WAY THEY OPERATE VERSUS THE WAY WE DO.
WE'RE TRYING TO S MUCH EFFICIENCY FOR OUR CITIZENS OUT OF THE SYSTEM WE HAVE AS POSSIBLE, OUT OF THE RULE STRUCTURE W FROM THE FEDERAL AND THE LOCAL EMS AGENCY.
>> NO, JUST WANTED TO AGREE WITH MS. RAMOS AMITH, IF WE WANT TO INCREASE THE FEES WE WAIT UNTIL THE END OF THE PANDEMIC.
RIGHT NOW IS NOT A GOOD TIME FOR PEOPLE TO BE HESITATING TO CALL THE AMBULANCE.
WE NEED TO LOOK AT WHAT WE CAN DO FOR PEOPLE WHO ARE IN NEED OF SUPPORT SO THEY DON'T HAVE A LARGE BILL.
OBVIOUSLY WE WANT TO COLLECT THE BILLS COMING TO US, HAVE THE BEST SYSTEM WE CAN, OBVIOUSLY IT IS DIFFICULT BECAUSE OF THE PANDEMIC BUT AT THE SAME TIME WE HAVE TO LOOK AT HOW WE CAPTURE AS MUCH AS WE CAN TO INVEST BACK IN OUR COMMUNITY AND INVEST BACK IN OUR EQUIPMENT AND EVERYTHING ELSE.
SO THANK YOU CHIEF FOR YOUR COMMENTS AND YOUR INFORMATION.
AND MR. ROCKWELL, DO YOU HAVE WHAT YOU NEED TO FORWARD ON THIS? OR --
>> ON THE AMBULANCE FEES DO WE HAVE MORE ON THE OTHER FEES AND CHARGES?
>> NOTHING SPECIFICALLY UNLESS THE COUNCIL HAS QUESTIONS.
[00:40:07]
>> I ASKED IF THEY HAD ANYTHING TO ADDRESS WITH HER AND THEY SAID NO.
>> THE REASON FOR DOING THIS IS WE'RE GETTING READY TO GO INTO A BUDGET REVIEW WHICH I KNOW RIGHT NOW WE'RE GOING DO HAVE COUNCILMEMBERS ASKING FOR MORE EXPENDITURES THAN WE HAVE MONEY TO SPEND.
>> SO I'M TRYING TO DEAL WITH WHAT I CALL FOUNDATIONAL ISSUES UPON WHICH THAT BUDGET IS ADDRESSED.
IF THE COUNCIL H IT'S CLEAR ON THE AMBULANCE FEES AND I ABSOLUTELY UNDERSTAND THE RATIONALE ON THAT.
IF THE SAME, ADDED TO E AS IT RELATES TO ALL THE OTHER FEES THAT WE HAVEN'T RAISED IN FOREVER, THAT'S FINE.
BUT THAT THEN TELLS US NOT TO ASSUME ON THE WHITE BOARD THAT THERE'S GOING TO BE ANY EXTRA REVENUE FROM FEES AND CHARGES.
WHICH YOU KNOW IT'S A COUNCIL POLICY DECISION.
IS THAT THE FEEDBACK I'M GETTING OR DOES THIS STILL STAY ON THE WHITE BOARD AS A POSSIBLE -- AMBULANCE FEES, THAT WAS CLEAR BUT THE REST OF THEM.
>> HAS THIS BEEN REVIEWED WITH THE BUILDING INDUSTRY OR WHOEVER ELSE WAS AFFECTED?
>> GRETCHEN WAS GOING TO GET A COMMENT BUT DIDN'T GET A CHANCE.
SHE GOT OFF THE LINE BEFORE SHE WAS ABLE TO.
SHE'S GOING TO SEND A WRITTEN RESPONSE.
>> LET ME REMIND EVERYBODY THAT WE DIDN'T -- WE'RE NOT TALKING ABOUT GOING FORWARD WITH THE BUILDING FEES YET.
WE STILL HAVE TO WORK WITH THOSE GROUPS.
>> SO ALL THESE FEES AFFECT OUR RESIDENTS.
SO I APOLOGIZE, BUT I'M NOT WILLING TO RAISE THE FEES ON OUR RESIDENTS AT THIS TIME.
I NIGHT RECONSIDER IT IN JANUARY WHEN WE SEE HOW THE PANDEMIC HAS AFFECTED US BUT I WAS THINKING MORE JULY NEXT FISCAL CYCLE.
BECAUSE ALL THESE FEES AFFECT OUR RESIDENTS.
>> IN SOME CASES THEY DO BECAUSE THERE'S PLANNING FEES IN HERE.
BUT THEY DO AFFECT, TO THE EXTENT WE'RE SUBSIDIZING FEES, THEY VERY DEFINITELY AFFECT OUR RESIDENTS.
AND MY OBLIGATION IS TO REMIND EVERYBODY THAT.
IF YOU CHOOSE TO GO FORWARD WITHOUT CHANGES, THAT'S FINE.
THAT'S THE COUNCIL'S DECISION.
BUT IT WAS MY OBLIGATION TO REMIND YOU THAT'S THE WAY IT WORKS.
>> OKAY, SO YOU WANT TO PUT IT ON THE WHITE BOARD AS LIKE DECEMBER 31ST? IF -- IF COUNCIL SUPPORTS THAT?
>> YES, IF THE COUNCIL DID SUPPORT IT THEN I WOULD PUT IT ON THE WHITE BOARD AS A POTENTIAL OFFSET TO SOME OF THE EXPENSES.
IF THE COUNCIL DOESN'T SUPPORT IT I WON'T WASTE YOUR TIME ON IT.
>> THAT'S WHY I WANTED TO SEE THIS SHEET WITH THE DIFFERENCE.
>> MR. ORTIZ, LOOKS LIKE YOU WANTED TO SAY SOMETHING SIR.
>> NO, I THINK FOR THE AMBULANCE FEES, I'M WILLING TO LEAVE THOSE AS-IS FOR NOW.
I THINK FOR THE OTHER FEES, IT'S GOING TO COME FROM OUR RESIDENTS, WHETHER IT'S FROM THE FEES OR IT'S FROM OUR GENERAL FUND.
SO I THINK THOSE WE SHOULD GO AHEAD AND BRING UP TO PAR WHAT OUR CURRENT COSTS ARE.
I HAVE TALKED TO STAFF, THERE ARE CERTAIN FEES WHERE WE ARE GOING TO HAVE TO DO SOMETHING EXTRA TO MAKE IT MAKE SENSE, RIGHT? I SAW ONE OF THEM WAS THE TEMPORARY SIGNS.
AND WE HAVE YOU KNOW IT'S GOING UP FROM $120 TO $300.
AND YOU KNOW, THE PERMITS ONLY SOMETHING LIKE 45 DAYS.
SO I THINK WE'RE GOING TO HAVE EVEN MORE ISSUES AT THAT POINT BECAUSE THEY WON'T WANT TO PAY THE FEES WHICH MAKES OUR ENFORCEMEN EVEN HARDER.
SO I THINK IF WE ARE GOING TO BRING UP THAT SOMETHING LIKE EXTENDING THAT TIME FRAME SO IT'S JUST 45 DAYS, IT COULD BE SOMETHING LONGER THAN THAT IF WE ARE GOING TO HAVE THE FEES THAT HIGH.
AND JUST -- JUST T RECOMMEND TO LOOK AT DIFFERENT WAYS TO RAISE THEM TO GIVE OUR RESIDENTS A LITTLE MORE BANG FOR THEIR BUCK IN PAYING THESE FEES BUT ALSO TO ENCOURAGE THEM, TO NOT DISCOURAG FROM COMING TO US AND GETTING THE RIGHT PERMITS AND PROCESSES.
>> I JUST WANTED TO MAKE THE POINT THAT THESE FEES ARE COST RECOVERY.
SO JUST TO MAKE CLEAR THAT WHAT WE'RE LOOKING AT COST RECOVERY FEE.
SO WE'RE NOT PROVIDING EXTRA FOR THE FEE, WE'RE JUST RECOVERING OUR TRUE COST IF THAT MAKES SENSE.
>> YEAH, BUT JUST GOING OFF OF THAT AS WELL, IT'S NOT GOING TO COST US ANYMORE TO EXTEND THAT TIME PERIOD.
SO LOOKING AT WAYS WHERE WE CAN EXTEND THE SERVICE TO OUR RESIDENTS WITHOUT HAVING
[00:45:03]
TO PROVIDE ANY EXTRA SERVICE OURSELVES.>> YEAH, BUT YOU'RE PICKING OUT ONE FEE OUT OF A MULTITUDE OF MULTI-- THERE'S PROBABLY LOT MORE TO LOOK AT AND PICKING AND CHOOSING IS PROBABLY GOING TO BE MORE DIFFICULT THAN TEMPORARY SIGN AND GIVE THEM 45 FACE RECOVERY COST DURING THIS PANDEMIC IS GOING TO BE VERY DIFFICULT FOR MOS BUSINESS AT ALL, LET ALONE ADDING ON AN EXTRA $100-SOME FOR A SIGN, LEADS PEOPLE NOT PULLING PERMITS AND OUR CODE ENFORCEMENT IS OUT CHECKING.
THERE HAS GOT TO BE A FINE LINE WHAT'S AFFORDABLE FOR THEM IN THAT TIME FRAME AND WHAT GOES UP.
I AGREE WITH YOU, I THINK THAT'S A LONGER DISCUSSION.
I AGREE WITH MS. AMITH THAT IF WE'RE LOOKING AT DOING THIS LET'S PLAN IT FOR THE NEXT FISCAL YEAR.
SEE WHAT KIND OF FUNDING WE HAVE, LET'S GET THROUGH THE PANDEMIC, AND LOOK WHERE WE GO TO PUTTING ON FEES, EVEN IF THEY ARE RESIDENTS WE KNOW WHAT WE HAVE NOW.
MAYOR PRO TEM, YOU WANTED TO SAY SOMETHING?
>> I WANTED TO WEIGH IN, IT'S NO DOUBT THAT FEES WILL NEED TO BE RAISED, 88%, WHATEVER THE MARKET WILL BEAR.
IN THE PAST, WE DID THE LAST STUDY IN 2012 AND WE DID A TIERED INCREASE IN 2013 AND 2014.
MAYBE WE SHOULD LOOK AT THIS AT THE BEGINNING OF THE YEAR, END OF THE YEAR, A LARGE JUMP MAYBE IT'S DONE IN TWO CYCLES.
A LOT O STRUGGLING OR OUT OF WORK.
I KNOW WE NEED THAT C RECOVERY AS WELL.
THERE IS ALWAYS A MIDDLE POINT AND I THINK WE NEED TO FIND IT.
>> AND I DON'T THINK WE'RE GOING TO DO IT FROM THE DAIS HERE TODAY.
>> JUST FOR CLARITY SAKE WE'RE TABLING THIS FOR NOW AND AT SOME POINT STAFF IS GOING TO BRING THIS UP FOR DISCUSSION MAYBE WITH THE BUDGET DISCUSSION AND THE TIME IS FOR NOT CHANGING ANY ANYTHING.
>> FOR SOME FEES, WOULD I LOOK AT IT AS PART OF THE BUDGET PROCESS TO LOOK TO SEE WHERE WE ARE AND WHERE WE SIT, THAT'S MY PERSONAL OPINION.
LEAVE THINGS WHERE THEY ARE, LET'S GET IT, SEE WHERE THE MONEY COMES, WHERE ARE WE GOING TO GO, GET FROM OUR RESIDENTS.
AS MR. ORTIZ SAYS, HE WANTS 45 DAYS, I THINK $300 FOR A TEMPORARY SIGN IS VERY HIGH MYSELF, FIND A HAPPY MEDIUM WE WANT TO SUPPORT, AMBULANCE FEES BECAUSE WE TALKED ABOUT IT, MAYBE THAT IS SOMETHING WE GIV BECAUSE THAT IS A SERVICE THAT IS PROVIDING INCOME TO OUR FIRE DEPARTMENT, WHERE WE CAN -- DON'T HAVE TO SUBSIDIZE AS MUCH.
WE CAN LOOK AT THEM AND GIVE IT A LOT MORE LOOK AT WE HAVE COMING UP THAN TRYING TO TAKE IT NOW.
>> AND I WAS GOING DO SAY EVEN IF THE COUNCIL LOOKS AT SOMETHING AND ADOPTS SOMETHING YOU CAN HAVE A DIFFERENT TIME.
>> I DON'T THINK THE COUNCIL HAS ANY APPETITE, DURING THIS PANDEMIC.
>> WE HAVE TO REVIEW AND MAKE DECISIONS AS TO WHEN.
>> WOULD YOU BE COMFORTABLE BRINGING THIS BACK FIRST PART OF THE YEAR AS A COUNCIL AND HAVE THEM BRING IT AS PART OF THE BUDGET? BECAUSE THEN WE CAN LOOK AT HOW IT'S GOING TO IN BUDGET WISE, RESERVES AND EVERYTHING ELSE.
>> AREN'T WE GOING DO REVIEW THE BUDGET IN THE NEXT COUPLE OF WEEKS?
>> BUT THAT'S THIS BUDGETS, I'M TALKING ABOUT NEXT YEAR'S BUDGET, EVERYBODY COMFORTABLE WITH THAT?
>> THANK YOU ALL FOR THAT DISCUSSION.
>> THANK YOU NICOLE FOR YOUR PATIENCE WITH US.
>> THANK YOU EVERYBODY, GREAT DISCUSSION.
>> AND THEN WE'RE GOING TO GO TO THE SHORT TERM RENTAL.
>> I WILL DO A VERY QUICK LEAD IN ON THIS TOO.
I THINK THE CONTEXT WE'RE DOING THIS IS A SITUATION IN THE COACHELLA VALLEY AND PERHAPS ALL OVER CALIFORNIA, WHERE THERE IS MORE AND MORE CONCERN FROM PERMANENT RESIDENTS ABOUT THE ABUSES THEY'RE PERCEIVIN FROM SHORTLY TERM RENTALS.
BY ABUSES WHAT I'M T ABOUT IS WHAT I WOULD CALL A PARTY HOUSE OR JUST THE NOISE AND THE FUSS IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD THAT PEOPLE AR CONCERNED ABOUT.
DURING THE WHOLE COVID CRISIS THERE HAS OF CONCERN ABOUT BRINGING PEOPLE INTO THE COMMUNITY.
IT'S ALARMING TO US FROM A STAFF STAND BECAUSE SHORT TERM RENTAL INDUSTRY
[00:50:02]
HAS BEEN VERY IMPORTANT TO US.IT'S ONE OF THE HIGHEST REVENUE SOURCES WE'VE GOT IN THE CITY.
SO WE AREN'T TRYING TO ROCK THE BOAT IN TERMS OF SHORT TERM RENTAL INDUSTRY.
LIKE SOME OF OUR N CITIES ARE TALKING ABOUT GETTING OUT OF THE SHORT TERM RENTAL BUSINESS, PUTTING LIMITS ON SHORTLY TERM RENTALS AND OF COURSE LIMITATIONS ON ABUSES.
SO WHEN STAFF L THIS, WE ARE NOT LOOKING AT IT FROM THE POINT THAT SHORT TERM RENTALS AS AN INDUSTRY IS A BAD THING.
WE'RE LOOKING AT IT FROM THE STANDPOINT THAT IT'S IMPORTANT TO OUR ECONOMY AND WE WANT TO PRESERVE IT.
AND WE THINK THE BEST W CAN HELP PRESERVE IT IS TO MAKE IT -- MAKE OUR ENFORCEMENT SUCH THAT OUR RESIDENTS FEEL OKAY ABOUT IT.
OUR RESIDENTS HAVE BEEN SUPPORTIVE IN THE PAST.
THEY'RE STARTING AS JASON CAN TELL YOU, THEY'RE STARTING TO LOSE PATIENCE WITH THIS BECAUSE OF THE NOISE AND THE ACTIVITY ON WEEKENDS HAS GOTTEN QUITE, QUITE SEVERE.
>> WELL, IT HAPPENS ALL THE TIME.
IT'S NOT OH, IT'S JUST A WEEKEND OR IT'S ONE NIGHT OF A WEEKEND.
I LIVE IN ONE OF THOSE SUBDIVISIONS AND I KNOW.
BUT WE'RE TRYING TO -- WE'RE TRYING TO COME UP WITH POLICY THAT WORKS FOR EVERYBODY WHICH IS OF COURSE QUITE A GOAL.
JASON AND ROXANN DIAZ HAVE PUT TOGETHER A POWERPOINT, THEY'RE GOING TO TAG TEAM AND GO THROUGH IT WITH US AND MAKE SOME SUGGESTIONS ON POLICY, AND I THINK THERE ARE SOME IMPORTANT POLICY ISSUES TO BE DEBATED IN THIS DISCUSSION.
THIS IS NOT GOING TO BE A SIMPLE EVERYBODY LISTENS AND AGREES KIND OF THINGS.
THERE ARE PLACES WHERE PEOPLE ARE GOING TO HAVE DIFFERENT OPINIONS.
WE WANT TO HEAR THAT DISCUSSION FROM THE COUNCIL.
WE'RE NOT ASKING YOU TO ADOPT ANYTHING TODAY.
WE WOULD LIKE DIRECTION T PROCEED WITH WHAT THE COUNCIL'S COMFORTABLE PROCEEDING WITH.
AND SO THAT, WITH THAT INTRODUCTION I'LL TURN IT OVER TO JASON AND ROXANN.
MAYOR, COUNCILMEMBERS, BOTH IN PERSON AND AT HOME.
WELL, THAT WAS A GREAT INTRODUCTION ON SHORT RENTALS.
I DON'T KNOW IF I NEED TO COVER ANYTHING ELSE.
I THINK WE CAN JUST PASS A NEW ORDINANCE AND GO HOME.
SO WE CAME UP WITH A SHORT AGENDA FOR THIS EVENING.
WE'RE GOING TO LOOK AT SOME OF THE CHALLENGES WITH SHORT TERM RENTALS.
I MOVED THIS AROUND A LITTLE BIT.
I HAVE A COMPARISON TO O VALLEY CITIES AND WHAT THEY'RE DOING AS FAR AS FEES AND FINES AND SOME OF THE RESTRICTIONS THAT THEY HAVE.
WE'RE GOING TO TALK ABOUT SOME UPDATED ORDINANCE, SOME -- WE HAVE SOME POINTS OF DISCUSSION THAT WE WOULD LIKE YOUR FEEDBACK ON.
AND SOME POTENTIAL STAFFING INCREASES TO DEAL NUISANCE EFFECT LIKE THE CITY MANAGER TALKED ABOUT.
SO LET'S GET INTO SOME OF OUR CURRENT CHALLENGES.
I WANT TO FRAME THIS AND WANT TO GIVE THE COUNCIL SOME GENERAL STATISTICS ON SHORT TERM RENTALS.
WE CURRENTLY HAVE 739 LICENSED SHORT TERM RENTALS.
WE KNOW MORE THAN 800 THAT ARE OPERATING IN OUR CITY, OPERATING OUTSIDE IT IS LEGAL BOUNDARIES AND THERE IS 4600 THAT ARE ADVERTISED IN OUR COMMUNITY, A LARGE NUMBER THAT ARE NOT BEING REGULATED.
IN THE LAST SIX MONTHS MY STAFF HAVE ISSUED CITATIONS, TEN CITATIONS FOR OCCUPANCY VIOLATIONS AND 18 CITATIONS FOR CAN LOCATIONS THAT WERE OPERATING BEYOND THE COVID RESTRICTION, RENTING THEM WITHOUT-WHEN THEY WEREN'T SUPPOSED TO.
SO THE CURRENT CHALLENGE WE HAVE LIKE THE CITY MANAGER TALKED ABOUT ARE THE IMPACTS TO NEIGHBORHOODS.
JUST THIS LAST WEEKEND AT SHORT TERM RENTALS WE HAD TWO LARGE PARTIES.
ONE WAS A WEDDING OF OVER 500 PEOPLE.
THERE WAS A LARGE PARTY AND THE NEIGHBORS WEREN'T TOO HAPPY WHEN THEY'RE LETTING OFF FIREWORKS AND THERE WERE SOME NEGATIVE EFFECTS TO THEM.
SO THIS AFFECTS EVERY NEIGHBORHOOD IN THE CITY.
THEY'RE EVERYWHERE AND MOST OF THE CHALLENGES DEAL WITH LOUD PARTIES AND PARKING.
SO LOTS OF PEOPLE COME, THEY COME DOWN FOR THE AND THREE USE THAT AS A PARTY PAD.
A LOT OF IT IS R AREN'T ALLOWING PEOPLE IN, YOU CAN'T FLY IN TO CERTAIN RESORTS.
A LOT OF PEOPLE FROM THE COAST COME OUT TO TO ENJOY OUR NICE WEATHER.
ANOTHER PROBLEM WE H ADMINISTRATIVE FINES DON'T WORK ON CORPORATIONS.
[00:55:05]
SO THERE'S NO MECHANISM UNDER OUR CURRENT ORDINANCE TO COLLECT ANY FINES ISSUED TO CORPORATIONS OR LLCS.THAT GOES ALONG W IS -- A LOT OF OUR PERMITTED OPERATIONS ARE PERMITTED TO CORPORATIONS, OR ENTITIES THAT DON'T -- AREN' UNDER THE LAW.
SO THERE'S NO WAY FOR US TO KNOW IN CIRCUMSTANCES, WHO ACTUALLY OWNS THESE PROPERTIES.
WE DO A VERY GOOD JOB OF COLLECTING T.O.T.
OFTEN THE AIRBNB AS YOU KNOW WE HAVE THE AGREEMENT WITH AIRBNB.
AND WE COLLECT ABOUT 75% OF OUR T.O.T.
TAXES IS COLLECTED THE AIRBNB PLATFORM.
I WANT TO TALK ABOUT THIS, THOUGH.
ACCORDING TO ONE OF THE MAJOR OPERATORS OF SHORT TERM RENTALS THAT MANAGES NUMEROUS PROPERTIES, ONLY ABOUT 25% OF ALL OF HIS RENTALS TAKE PLACE ON THE AIRBNB PLATFORM.
MOST OF THEM ARE PRIVATE TRANSACTIONS, MOST OF THEM TAKE PLACE ON ONE OF THE OTHER PLATFORMS THAT ARE OUT THERE THAT CHARGE THE FEES THAT AIRBNB CHARGES.
SO WE COLLECTED A LOT O MONEY ON AIRBNB.
BUT IT'S ONLY A SMALL PERCENTAGE OF WHAT COULD BE COLLECTED IN T.O.T.
WE'RE ALSO WORKING I PROBLEM OF SHORT TERM RENTALS TAKING PLACE ON ADU'S.
SO WE HAVE PROPERTIES IN OUR CITY WHERE THERE'S TERM RENTAL, ADU, ALL IN THE SAME PROPERTY.
SO IN ONE PARTICULAR CASE THERE'S TWO, ON A PROPERTY, AN ADU AND A JUNIOR ADU AND THE MAIN HOUSE FIVE BEDROOM HOUSE BEING RENTED OUT AS A SHORT TERM RENTAL.
SO ON THE WEEKEND YOU H TWO FAMILIES LIVING AT THIS HOUSE PLUS UP TO TEN PEOPLE STAYING AT THE SHORT TERM RENTAL.
SO YOU HAVE PARKING I YOU HAVE NOISE ISSUES AND YOU HAVE THE COMPATIBILITY BETWEEN A PARTY PAD IN EFFECT AND A SINGLE FAMILY APARTMENT IN THE BACKYARD.
SO WHEN WE LOOK AT WAYS TO IMPROVE OUR ORDINANCE AND THE SHORT TERM RENTAL PROGRAM IN GENERAL, THE IS TO REDUCE THE IMPACTS OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD.
TO PROTECT GUESSES AND CONSUMERS THAT COME TO OUR CITY AND EXPECT NICE PLACES TO STAY, PLACES THAT ARE SAFE FOR THE FAMILY DOM INCREASE THE ACCOUNTABILITY OF AS FAR AS PAYING T.O.T.
TAXES AND PAYING FEES AND THE ENFORCEABILITY OF OUR LAWS ITSELF.
WHAT WAS IMAGINED IN 2 WHEN OUR LAST REVISION TOOK PLACE, A LOT HAS HAPPENED AND IT HAS CHANGED OVER THE YEARS.
WE WOULD ALSO LIKE TO MODERNIZE THE PERMITTING PROCESS.
OUR CURRENT PROCESS IS PAPER-BASED.
WE CAN PAY TAXES AND FEES ONLINE BUT IT'S SORT OF IDEAL SITUATION.
WE WOULD LIKE TO MODEL T PERMITTING PROCESS SORT OF LIKE THE WATER BILL WHERE YOU HAVE A PORTAL FOR YOUR BUSINESS, OR FOR YOUR SHORT TERM RENTAL, CAN YOU GO IN, YOU APPLY FOR IT ONLINE, YOU COMMUNICATE WITH THE CITY THROUGH A BUSINESS PORTAL, YOU PAY YOUR TAXES AND FEES AND IF THERE'S ANY FINES DUE, YOU CAN PAY IT ALL IN ONE PLACE.
THAT WOULD PROVIDE FOR ELECTRONIC DATA CAPTURE, IMPROVES THE PROCESS, AND ULTIMATELY WE WANT COLLECT AS MUCH T.O.T.
TAXES OWED TO THE CITY AS POSSIBLE BECAUSE TOTALLY TAXES IS WHAT PAYS FOR OUR CITY SERVICES.
AND WITH THAT, I'LL HAVE ROXANN COME UP AND WE'LL TALK ABOUT SPECIFIC CHANGES WE'RE GOING TO PROPOSE WITH AN ORDINANCE CHANGE.
SO I WANTED TO TALK ABOUT SOME REALLY HIGHLIGHTS OF SOME CHANGES.
THIS IS NOT EVERYTHING AND CERTAINLY IF THE COUNCIL PROVIDES THAT WE CAN MOVE FORWARD WE'LL MAKE SURE THAT YOU'LL NOTE ALL TH DIFFERENCES FROM OUR CURRENT ORDINANCE TO THE PROPOSED ORDINANCE.
FIRST OFF, WHAT WE'VE MADE IS CURRENT, THE WAY APPLICATION WORKS IS THAT THE OWNER CAN SUBMIT IT AND SIGN IT OR THEIR AGENT CAN.
AND THAT REALLY RELIEVES THE OWNER, THE PROPERTY OWNER, LEGAL PROPERTY OWNER FROM A LOT OF RESPONSIBILITY IN SOME SENSE.
SO WE WANT TO BE ABLE TO REALLY INCREASE THAT RESPONSIBILITY ON THE PROPERTY OWNER, ACTION THAT HAS TO BE TAKEN BY HIM OR HER RATHER THAN TO LEAVE IT TO AN AGENT SO THAT WE CAN KNOW WHO THE CAN AND THEREFORE, NOT GO
[01:00:05]
THROUGH A MIDDLE PERSON.SO WHAT WE'RE PROPOSING IS CERTAIN ACTIONS THAT CAN ONLY BE TAKEN BY THE OWNER OR BY AN AGENT.
THE OWNER'S APPLICATION W REQUIRE MORE ACTION THAN WE HAVE TODAY.
WE WOULD REQUEST THE WEBSITE ADDRESSES OF WHERE THEY ADVERTISE, WE WOULD REQUEST PHOTOS, WE WOULD ENSURE THAT THERE'S INSURANCE, WE WOULD REQUEST MAILING LABELS AND A NUMBER OF OTHER THINGS.
SO FROM OUR PERSPECTIVE THESE ARE THE ITEMS NEED OR THAT CODE ENFORCEMENT NEEDS IN ORDER TO DO WHAT THEY NEED TO DO WITH RESPECT TO THE ENFORCEMENT OF THAT ORDINANCE.
AND THEN, WITH RESPECT TO HOAS AND I KNOW THIS BEEN A TOPIC OF DISCUSSION, WE ARE GOING TO REQUIRE THAT AN HOA APPROVAL LETTER BE PROVIDED.
AND THAT APPROVAL L TO ENSURE THAT THE HOA, ONE, THAT THEY KNOW WHAT'S COMING THEIR WAY BUT ALSO TO MAKE SURE THAT WE KNOW THAT SHORT TERM RENTAL IS PERMITTED IN THAT HOA.
IF THERE'S A COMMUNITY THAT DOESN'T HAVE AN HOA BUT IS GOVERNED BY CC &R'S, LONG BEFORE THE CONCEPT OF SHORT TERM RENTALS SO THEI RS MAY NOT ADDRESS IT.
UNLESS THEY SPECIFICALLY ARE PROHIBIT OR LIMIT IT, THAT'S THE ISSUE THAT'S ALWAYS OCCURRING BETWEEN THE HOA AND THE HOMEOWNERS.
AND SO AGAIN, THE PURPOSE IS TO DETERMINE WHETHER THE HOA PERMITS IT OR NOT.
ANOTHER CONCEPT IS NEIGHBORHOOD NOTICE.
AND WE'RE REQUESTING MAILING LABELS OF 500 FEET, THAT'S 200 FEET FURTHER THAN OUR EXISTING RADIUS FOR PUBLIC NOTICES, WHICH IS 300.
AND A NOTICE WILL BE SENT TO THOSE PARTIES PROPERTIES EXCUSE ME WITHIN 500 FEET, NOT ONLY TO LEGAL OWNER OFF THE ASSESSOR'S ROLL BUT ALSO TO THE OCCUPANT.
SO THERE ARE SOME UNITS T ARE OWNED BY PEOPLE WHO LIVE IN SAN DIEGO AND THE OCCUPANT IS THE ONE WHO HAS ALL THE IMPACTS.
AND IN THAT LETTER, INFORMATION IS GOING TO PROVIDED AS TO HOW TO LODGE COMPLAINTS, AND ANY OTHER INFORMATION WITH RESPECT TO THAT SHORT TERM RENTAL.
AND THAT WILL BE SENT WITHIN 30 DAYS OF APPROVAL OF THE PERMIT.
A NOTICE WILL ALSO BE SENT IF THE PERMIT IS SUSPENDED OR REVOKED OR DENIED.
BECAUSE IN THAT SENTENCE NEIGHBORS ARE EYES AND EARS AS WELL, IF THEY RECEIVED NOTICE THAT THE BEEN PERMITTED OR DENIED OR REVOKED, AND IF THERE IS ACTIVITY PROVIDED ON THAT PROPERTY, THEY WILL LET U KNOW.
IT IS TO PROVIDE CHECK AND BALANCE AS WELL, BECAUSE I KNOW WE DO GET A LOT OF INFORMATION FROM NEIGHBORS.
AND THIS AT LEAST PROVIDES THEM SOME NOTICE IF THEY'RE INTERESTED IN THIS TOPIC OF KNOWING WHEN A SHORT TERM RENTAL COMES INTO A COMMUNITY AND WHEN A SHORT TERM RENTAL LEAVES COMMUNITY.
I DON'T KNOW IF YOU NEEDED TO ADD ANYTHING ELSE.
I DO WANT TO SAY THAT WE GET LOTS OF COMPLAINTS.
WE PROBABLY GET ON AVERAGE THREE OR FOUR A DAY DIFFERENT SHORT TERM RENTALS.
IT'S FUNNY WHEN WE COME B ON MONDAY MORNING OUR HOT LINE IS ALWAYS FULL OF COMPLAINTS ABOUT PARTIES OVER THE WEEKEND.
WE'VE NEVER SEEN THE ROUGH VOLUME OF RENTALS THAT HAVE TAKEN PLACE BEFORE.
IT'S USUALLY IN YEARS PAST, IT WAS A LOT OF COMPLAINTS IN APRIL.
BUT NOW IT'S A LOT OF COMPLAINTS ALL THE TIME BECAUSE THE RENTALS ARE HAPPENING ALL THE TIME.
IT'S NO LONGER A S IT'S A YEAR ROUND OPERATION FOR THE MOST PART FOR MOST PLACES.
WE TYPICALLY AND CURRENTLY WE HAVE THE GENERAL DENIAL PROVISIONS, COMMIT FRAUD, YOU MISREPRESENT, THINGS OF THAT SORT, WELL NOW WE'VE MADE SURE TO STRENGTHEN THAT AREA.
AND SO A PERMIT WILL BE DENIED IF THE OWNER'S DELINQUENT IN THE PAYMENT OF THEIR T.O.T.
TAXES THAT ARE RELATED TO THE SHORT TERM RENTALS.
[01:05:04]
THIS IS NOT -- THIS DOESN'T -- I MEAN WE CAN'T GO AFTER THOSE -- THOSE T.O.T.TAXES JUST TO MAKE THE WAY THAT WE WOULD GO AFTER THOSE T.O.T.
TAXES WOULD BE THROUGH THE T.O.T.
WE'RE NOT PENALIZING T FOR THAT.
WHAT WE'RE PENALIZING, IF YOU HAVEN'T PAID YOU'RE NOT GOING TO GET A PERMIT.
IF THE OWNER HAS VIOLATIONS RELATED TO THAT SHORT TERM RENTAL IF THE LICENSE HAS BEEN SUSPENDED OR REVOKED WITHIN THE PAST 1 AGAIN CC & R'S PROHIBIT THE USE OF THE SHORT TERM OR THERE'S PENDING THE CODE VIOLATIONS.
THE PERMIT WILL BE ONLY GOOD FOR ONE YEAR FROM THE DATE THAT IT'S ISSUED SO IT WILL BE ROLLING, IT WON'T BE BUSINESS TAXES THAT HAPPEN FROM YEAR TO YEAR, AND IT AUTOMATICALLY EXPIRES IT'S RENEWED.
SO WHAT THAT MEANS IF SOMEBODY DOESN'T RENEW, THAT IS EQUAL TO AN INVALID PERMIT.
THEY WOULD HAVE T OVER AGAIN AND PAY A APPELLANT PENDLETON.
SOMETHING WE ARE LOOKING AT THAT OTHER CITIES ARE INCLUDING, IS THAT THE PERMIT IS REVOCABLE IF THE SHORT TERM RENTA IS VIOLATED X NUMBER OF TIMES.
WE INTERNALLY HAVE T ABOUT IS IT TWO VIOLATIONS, IS IT THREE VIOLATIONS, I DON'T KNOW IF THE COUNCIL HAS A PREFERENCE IN TERMS OF THAT.
BUT IT'S REALLY TO START REVOCATION PROCEEDINGS AND NOT WAIT UNTIL RENEWAL PROCESS COMES UP BUT TO DO IT IN THE MOMENT.
IF THERE'S CONSTANTLY E-CONSTANT FLAGRANT VIOLATIONS OF THE ORDINANCE.
I DON'T KNOW IF ANYBODY HAS ANY THOUGHTS ABOUT THAT.
AND ANY REVOCATION PROCESS WOULD GO THROUGH A THIRD PARTY HEARING OFFICER AS WELL.
SO IT'S KIND OF THE THREE STRIKE RULE AND I THINK WE WERE LOOKING AT THREE.
>> AND THAT'S CONSISTENT WITH MOST VALLEY CITIES.
MOST VALLEY CITIES HAVE IMPLEMENTED A THREE-STRIKE POLICY.
>> WHEN YOU SAY THREE STRIKES THAT'S NOISE VIOLATIONS, IT'S A -- WHAT IS -- WHAT IS A STRIKE?
>> THREE CONFIRMED VIOLATIONS WHICH WOULD BE THREE CITATIONS.
>> THREE CITATIONS BASED ON THE ORDINANCE
>> IT COULD BE PARKING, IT COULD BE NOT HAVING THE LOCAL CONTACT PERSON AVAILABLE WITHIN THE 45 MINUTE RESPONSE TIM MINUTE RESPONSE TIME, NOISE, SO IT'S THE GAMUT.
YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT PARKING, TALKED ABOUT THIS, BUT JUST PASSING ADU -- HOW DO WE ENFORCE SOMETHING WHEN WE DON'T -- WE CAN'T EVEN ENFORCE WHAT GOES THROUGH? I SHOWED THE CITY MANAGER THE OTHER DAZE, (INAUDIBLE) GOING DOWN AT 7:00 IN THE MORNING AND THE CARS ARE ALL AGAINST THE SIDE, THE TRASH CANS ARE IN THE MIDDLE OF THE ROAD, AND THERE'S A GAP BIG ENOUGH FOR ME T MINI COOPER THROUGH THE MIDDLE.
HOW CAN YOU GET A P CITATION WHEN YOU CAN'T EVEN ENFORCE PUTTING THE CARS IN THE GARAGE?
WHAT WE WOULD NORMALLY LOOK FOR IS THE RESIDENCY OF THE VEHICLE.
I KNOW ADU'S ARE GOING TO B TOUGH, THAT IS A NEW CONCEPT, WHAT WE WOULD NORMALLY DEFAULT TO IS KNOCK ON THE DOOR, SAYING ARE THESE YOUR VEHICLES, ASSOCIATED WITH THE ACCESSORY DWELLING RESIDENCE, GETTING THE CARS OFF THE STREET, IF YOU OAR TEMPORARY GUEST IN OUR CITY SPENDING FRIDAY AND SATURDAY NIGHT IF WE GET A ABOUT IT WE'RE JUST GOING TO KNOCK ON THE DOOR AND TRY TO FIGURE OUT AND MITIGATE IT AS MUCH AS POSSIBLE.
WURP OF THE THINGS WE'RE GOING TO PROPOSE IS THE LISTING OF THE NUMBER OF APPROVED PARKING SPACES WITH THE ADVERTISEMENT.
SO YOU'LL HAVE THE OCCUPANCY PLUS THE APPROVED PARKING FOR THE LOCATION, ALL IN THE LISTING WHEN YOU MAKE THE DECISION TO RENT A PROPERTY VERSUS ANOTHER PROPERTY.
>> ASSORT OF LIKE AN ENFORCEMENT NIGHTMARE.
>> AND IT WOULD BE PROPERTY ONSITE AS WELL.
AND WOULD IT ALSO PROHIBIT THE USE OF SOMEBODY BRINGING AN RV PARKING IT AND USING THAT AS WELL AS ANOTHER HOUSE NEXT TO THE SHOR RENTAL THAT THEY'RE IN.
SOME OTHER HIGHLIGHTS, WITH RESPECT TO THE ORANGES, WITH RESPECT TO OPERATIONS, THERE WE GO, WE LOOKED AT THIS FROM IMPROVED OPERATIONAL REQUIREMENTS.
THIS YEAR WITH THE COVID PANDEMIC AND HOW WE SHORT TERM RENTALS TWROP THEIR USE DURING THAT OF TIME WHERE THEY COULD ONLY BE USED FOR COVID RELATED PURPOSES WE INSTITUTED THE SUBMISSION OF SHORT TERM RENTAL CONTRACTS.
[01:10:04]
AND I THINK JASON COULD ATTEST TO THAT.IT PROVIDED US A LOT MORE INFORMATION.
AND THAT'S WHAT W LOOKING TO CARRY OVER HERE AS WELL.
ALSO, SOME ENHANCED CHECK IN PROCEDURES THAT CAN BE DONE VIRTUALLY, BUT ALSO, TO MAKE SURE THAT THE OWNER IS PROVIDING CERTAI INFORMATION TO THE RENTER.
THE LOCAL CONTACT PERSON, THAT'S THE PERSON WHO RESPONDS TO OUR CALL TO THEM.
THAT THERE'S A L DISTURBANCE, THERE'S A PARKING ISSUE, THERE'S A TRASH ISSUE, THAT PERSON MUST LIVE WITHIN THE COACHELLA VALLEY, AND WE'RE LOOKING AT THE RESPONSE TIME AND I FORGET WHAT AI CURRENTLY IS, IS IT 45 MINUTES?
>> 45 MINUTES SO WE'RE KIND OF FIGURING OUT IF IT'S 45 OR 30.
SOME VALLEY CITIES HAVE LOOKED AT 30 MINUTES.
THERE HAS ALWAYS BEEN A PROHIBITION AGAINST AMPLIFIED SOUND.
KIDS PLAYING OUTSIDE CAN AFTER 10:00.
HAVING THOSE OUTDOOR BARBECUES AND PARTIES AND WHATNOT, WE'RE LOOKING AT THAT AS WELL.
AS I MENTIONED, PARKING MUST BE ONSITE, OCCUPANCY, AVAILABLE PARKING MUST BE DISPLAYED IN ALL THE ADVERTISEMENTS.
PROHIBITION ON COMMERCIAL USE.
WE'LL TALK A LITTLE BIT MORE AS A DISCUSSION ITEM.
WE HAVE ALWAYS HAD A PROHIBITION THAT YOU CAN'T RENT THE SHORT TERM TROANL A CORPORATION.
YOU COULDN'T RENT OUT A PORTION OF YOUR HOME JUST THE POOL WHICH IS A NEW THING HAPPENING THESE DAYS.
WHERE PEOPLE ARE JUST RENTING THEIR POOL OUT FOR USE, DAY USE BY PEOPLE.
NOT HERE BUT J PHENOMENON THAT IS OCCURRING.
AND SO WE'RE TRYING TO INCLUDE MORE STRENGTH AND PROVISIONS WITH RESPECT TO COMMERCIAL USE.
>> I DON'T KNOW IF YOU HAVE ANY COMMENTS ON THAT A.
>> OUR FIRST TOPIC FOR I GUESS A THOUGHT FROM THE COUNCIL THAT WE'D LIKE TO GET SOME FEEDBACK IS OCCUPANCY.
CURRENTLY, OUR OCCUPANCY PROVISIONS FOR -- LET ME STEP BACK.
SO THE WAY THAT SHORT TERM RENTAL ORDINANCES LOOK AT OCCUPANCY, THEY LOOK AT IT IN A VARIETY OF WAYS.
OCCUPANCY AMONGST DIFFERENT CITIES VARY.
AND IT'S EITHER DETERMINED AS A DAYTIME OCCUPANCY WHERE YOU HAVE ONE NUMBER, A NIGHTTIME OCCUPANCY WHERE YOU HAVE A DIFFERENT NUMBER, SO FOR EXAMPLE, BETWEEN THE HOURS OF 8 AND 10 P.M, YOU CAN HAVE 20 PEOPLE, I'M JUST MAKING THAT UP.
AND THEN FROM THE HOURS O 10 P.M.
YOU COULD ONLY HAVE EIGHT PEOPLE.
AND THEN THERE'S A SET STANDARD FOR 24 HOURS, REGARDLESS OF TIME.
OUR ORDINANCE HAS A MAXIMUM OVERNIGHT OCCUPANCY THAT SETS THE INITIAL OCCUPANCY AT 2 PEOPLE REGARDLESS OF THE SIZE OF THE UNIT OR THE HOME, AND PLUS A NUMBER THAT DOES NOT EXCEED TWO PERSONS PER BEDROOM.
SO IF YOU LOOK AT THIS CHART, I HAVE THE NUMBER OF BEDROOMS, ZERO TO STUDIO, THE MAXIMUM OCCUPANCY, THIS IS WHAT WE'RE PROPOSING, LEGALITY ME RUN IT THROUGH YOU AS CURRENT, THAT WOULD BE THE SAME UNDE CURRENT ORDINANCE.
WE ARE PROPOSING THAT IT STAYS AT 2.
UNDER OUR CURRENT ORDINANCE YOU'RE ALLOWED FOUR.
AND THEN TWO BEDROOMS WE'RE PROPOSING FOUR AS MAXIMUM OCCUPANCY, OUR CURRENT ORDINANCE WOULD ALLOW 6.
AND THEN THREE BEDROOMS, WE'RE PROPOSING SIX, AGAIN CURRENT ORDINANCE 8.
AND THEN FOUR BEDROOMS WE'VE UPPED THAT TO 10 AND THAT WOULD BE THE SAME UNDER OUR CURRENT ORDINANCE BUT AT FIVE OR MORE IT WOULD STAY 10.
WHERE UNDER O ORDINANCE IT WOULD BE 12.
AND THEN THERE'S A V PROCESS WHERE AN INSPECTOR CAN COME OUT AND DETERMINE THAT THE HOME CAN ACCOMMODATE MORE THAN 1 PERSONS.
MORE THAN THE OCCUPANCY LISTED HERE.
AND SO WE ARE PROPOSING TO ELIMINATE THAT.
SO OUR PROPOSAL IS A FLAT OCCUPANCY THAT STAYS CONSTANT THROUGHOUT THE PERSON'S STAY.
AND THIS WOULD ELIMINATE OR AT LEAST WHAT OUR GOAL IS, IS TO ELIMINATE THAT DAYTIME-NIGHTTIME IMPACT THAT'S OCCURRING RESPECT TO THE PARTIES AND TO RECENT HOME AS A GATHERING SPACE AND AS A PARTY SPACE FOR OTHERS TO COME IN BOTH DAY AND NIGHT.
AND SO AGAIN, THIS IS A SHIFT OF WHAT NOW AND YOU KNOW WE WERE TALKING INTERNALLY ABOUT IT.
IT WOULD ELIMINATE SOMEBODY RENTING OUT A HOME TO CHRISTMAS DINNER FOR 20, FOR
[01:15:03]
EXAMPLE.BECAUSE IF YOU'RE RENTING A LARGE HOME EVEN THE FIVE BEDROOM HOME YOU COULD ONLY HAVE TEN.
AND THE CONCEPT IS TO RETAIN THE RESIDENTIAL USE AND THE PURPOSE OF RESIDENTIAL USE FOR THAT HOME.
AND SO I WILL LET OTHERS JUMP IN.
>> NO, I DON'T WANT TO STOP YOU.
>> I TURNED IT OFF INSTEAD OF ON.
CAN STILL HAVE CHRISTMAS DINNER FOR 20 IF IT'S YOUR HOME.
>> AND YOU'RE HAVING PEOPLE OVER.
IT'S ONLY YOU CAN'T RENT YOUR HOME TO SOMEONE IN ORDER TO HAVE CHRISTMAS DINNER FOR 20, THAT'S THE POINT.
>> ANY THOUGHTS OF THAT IN TERMS OF THE COUNCIL?
>> I CAN'T SEE ANYBODY TON COUNCIL.
I CAN'T SEE YOU IF YOU A WAVING YOU'RE ON YOUR OWN.
SO DO YOU WANT ME T ASK ABOUT THE LAST PAUSE OR ALL OF THEM? HOW FAR ARE WE FROM THE END OF THE PRESENTATION
>> A FEW MORE SLIDES BUT WHY DON'T YOU ASK ALL OF THEM.
>> ARE WE ESSENTIALLY ELIMINATING PARTY HOUSES, BECAUSE WE'RE LIMITING THE NUMBER OF PEOPLE IN A SHORT TERM RENTAL?
>> YES, I HAVE A SLIDE FOR DISCUSSION OF WHETHER THE COUNCIL WANTS TO LOOK AT SOME OF THE HOMES THAT I KNOW THAT ARE ESTATE HOMES THAT ARE PURPOSELY BEING USED FOR LARGE PARTIES.
MORE OF YOUR WEDNESDAYINGS AND WHATNOT.
>> FOR WEDDINGS, I KNOW WE HAVE A FIVE ACRE ESTATE THAT ADVERTISES FOR 300, PARTY, I'M NOT SURE HOW MANY SPEND THE NIGHT, WHAT THEY CAN ACCOMMODATE IN THE BEDROOMS. I'M ASKING MORE ABOUT THE DAY USES OF THE WEDDINGS AND QUINCINERA AND THINGS OF OF THAT NATURE.
>> I WENT ON THAT WEBSITE TO SEE WHAT IT IS, AND EVEN THOUGH IT'S BEING UTILIZED, LET ME STEP BACK.
IT'S A RESIDENTIAL U UTILIZED FOR COMMERCIAL PURPOSES IN A SENSE IT'S A PARTY VENUE FOR WEDDINGS FOR LARGE CORPORATE EVENTS.
HOWEVER WHEN YOU RESERVE IT, YOU RESERVE IT AS A SHORT TERM RENTAL.
IT ASKS YOU HOW MANY NIGHTS, IT INDICATES THAT I PAY T.O.T, AND THEN THERE'S A CHECK BOX, THAT HOW MANY PEOPLE, IF I'M HAVING AN EVENT AND HOW MANY PEOPLE, AND THEN IF SO, I PRESS THAT BOX AND THE ANOTHER AMOUNT COMES UP.
SO IT'S THIS DUAL PURPOSE TYPE OF HOME, THAT'S REALLY A COMMERCIAL USE IN A RESIDENTIAL ZONE, RENTED AS A SHORT TERM RENTAL.
AND SO YOU'RE NOT PROPOSING ANY VARIANCE FOR CONTINUE TO DO THAT, YOU'RE PROPOSING TO ELIMINATE --
>> THAT IS A TOPIC OF DISCUSSION FOR THE COUNCIL.
THE OTHER QUESTION I HAD BECAUSE YOU MENTIONED YOU WERE GOING TO SINGLED OUT THESE NOTICES TO RAID USE 30 DAYS BEFORE THE EVENT.
IS THIS NOW EXTENDING THE PERIOD FURTHER OUT THAT AN APPLICANT HAS TO APPLY?
>> NO, WE WITH SENDS THE FIRST NOTICE THAT WE WOULD SEND TO THE RESIDENTS WOULD BE 30 DAYS AFTER THE PERMIT IS ISSUED.
>> YES, TO LEGALITY THEM KNOW THE PERMIT HAS BEEN ISSUED, HERE IS THE INFORMATION OF WHO TO CALL IF THERE'S A COMPLAINT.
IF THE PERMIT FOR WHATEVER REASON IS REVOKED OR SUSPENDED, OR DENIED, WE WOULD SEND A NOTICE AS WELL WITHIN 500 FEET.
SO THAT THE RESIDENT KNOWS THAT THAT -- THERE'S VALID PERMIT ON THE PROPERTY.
>> OKAY, AND YOU'RE PROPOSING THE THREE STRIKES RULE.
>> IS THAT THREE STRIKES PER YEAR OR FOR PERPETUITY? IS THAT KIND OF --
THERE THROUGH THE PERMIT TERMS SO THROUGH THE ONE YEAR.
NOW THE WAY I UNDERSTOOD THIS PRESENTATION WAS WE WERE REALLY GOING TO HELP NEIGHBORHOODS THEIR NEIGHBORHOOD FEEL AND BE VOID OF ALL OF THESE PARTY HOUSES THAT ARE POPPING UP.
BUT IT DOES KIND OF S LITTLE BIT TO ME THAT WE'RE MAKING IT A TAD, MORE THAN A TAD MORE DIFFICULT FOR AN INDIVIDUAL WHO WANTS T SHORT TERM RENTAL TO GO THROUGH THE PROCESS.
I KNOW WE'RE P PROTECTION FOR THE CITY TO GO AFTER THE ACTUAL OWNERS BUT IS THE PROCESS ACTUALLY BEING MORE COMPLICATE THE AVERAGE PERSON WHO WANTS TO HAVE A SHORT TERM RENTAL?
>> I WOULD SAY WE ARE ASKING FOR MORE INFORMATION.
HOWEVER, ANY ORDINANCE HERE IN THE VALLEY WE'VE BEEN LOOKING AT THAT AND COMPARING THEM.
THEY TOO ARE ASKING FOR THE SAME INFORMATION.
SO I DON'T BELIEVE THAT WE ARE BEING ANY MORE THAN ANY OF THE OTHER VALLEY
[01:20:05]
CITIES.AND I THINK THAT WHEN YOU LOOK AT THE FACT THAT SOME OF THESE HOMES ARE REALLY RUN BY CORPORATE ENTITIES, AND SO IT'S A BUSINESS SO WE'RE ASKING FOR MORE INFORMATION.
I DON'T THINK IT'S -- AND I THINK WHAT JASON SAID IN TERMS OF PUTTING THIS ON AN ONLINE FORMAT, WE'RE ALSO COGNIZANT OF TRYING TO MAK SURE THAT IT'S USER FRIENDLY.
BECAUSE I THINK THAT THIS WORKS AS LONG AS IT'S USER FRIENDLY AND TO FACILITATE THAT.
IT'S A LITTLE MORE WORK PERSON RENTAL.
>> FOR PEOPLE WHO ARE RENTING OUT THEIR PROPERTY.
GETTING THE PERMIT'S NOT MORE DIFFICULT.
I THINK IF WE HAVE INSPECTION ON RENEWAL THAT WOULD BE AN EXTRA STEP THAT PEOPLE ARE NOT USED TO.
AND WE ARE, WHEN WE GET TO THE END OF THIS REPORT, YOU'RE GOING TO SEE THAT WE'RE GOING TO ASK A HIGHER FEE.
OUR FEE IS AN NEGLIGIBLE AND INFINITESMAL.
>> BACK TO THE 30 DAYS, YOU SAID 30 DAYS AFTER THE PERMIT IS ISSUED WHEN THE NOTICES WILL BE SENT?
WE CAN SEND THOSE NOTICES OUT TEN DAYS AFTER THE PERMIT IS ISSUED.
>> IF I PULL A PERMIT FOR AN EVENT IN TWO WEEKS --
>> NO NO, SORRY, THIS IS THE 30 DAYS WHICH WE CAN SHORTEN WOULD ONLY BE WHEN THE SHORT TERM RENTAL PERMIT IS ISSUED.
>> OKAY, OKAY, AND THEN THE LAST QUESTION IS, WHY IS IT THAT WE CAN'T GO AFTER CORPORATIONS TRUSTS AND LLCS?
>> I'M GOING TO HAVE JASON ANSWER THAT.
>> UNDER STATE LAW THE NORMAL PROCEDURE FOR AN ADMINISTRATIVE CITATION, WE CAN ISSUE A CITATION TO ANYBODY BUT ONLY IF WE CAN COLLECT IS IF THAT IS BILLED TO SOMEBODY WITH A SOCIAL SECURITY NUMBER.
WE CAN'T PLACE THE CITATION OR FINE ON PROPERTY TAXES, WE CAN'T PLACE THE CITATION ON A CORPORATE ENTITY BECAUSE THERE IS NO ARE SOCIAL SECURITY NUMBER ASSIGNED TO THAT CORPORATE ENTITY.
IT HAS TO BE -- W COLLECT AGAINST SOMEBODY WITH A SOCIAL SECURITY NUMBER.
>> I DON'T KNOW IF ANY COUNCILMEMBERS HAVE QUESTIONS THAT I'M HAPPY TO ANSWER.
>> WE TALKED ABOUT ADDITIONAL STAFFING FOR OUR STR'S CAN YOU EXPAND ON THAT?
>> AND ALSO MAYBE WE'RE GOING TO GO OVER IT LATER.
>> BUT YOU TALK ABOUT THE NUMBER OF PEOPLE THAT COULD BE IN AN SDR ONE TIME OR IS THAT GOING TO BE DURING CERTAIN HOURS, OR IS THAT SOMETHING WE'RE GOING TO TALK ABOUT? BECAUSE I SEE THAT WE ARE WANTING TO ELIMINATE PARTY HOUSES.
AND I UNDERSTAND, YOU KNOW, IF WE LOOK LIKE SOME PROPERTIES LIKE MONTAGE, THEY'RE INUNDATED WITH THESE, I UNDERSTAND, BU ALSO, WE WANT TO TRY TO WORK WITH SOME OF THE FOLKS AND MEET THEM HALFWAY SO TO SPEAK, BECAUSE I MEAN, AFTER COVID, WE HOPE TO GET OUR FESTIVALS BACK, THIS IS A REVENUE GENERATE FOR THE CITY BUT WE ALSO DON'T WANT TO USE REVENUE OVER OUR WHO LIVE THERE YEAR ROUND.
>> WE'RE GOING TO GO OVER THE FEE PROCESS AT THE END AND THE ADDITIONAL STAFFING.
YES, THIS IS THE TOPIC THAT I'M LOOKING FOR DIRECTION IN THE COUNCIL.
WHAT WE'RE PROPOSING AND WHAT'S UP FOR DISCUSSION IS OCCUPANCY.
WE ARE LOOKING FOR A STATIC OCCUPANCY THAT WOULD HOURS.
THERE WOULDN'T BE A DIFFERENTIATION BETWEEN IS DAYTIME AND NIGHTTIME.
SO CURRENTLY IF YOU HAVE A TWO BEDROOM, IF YOU WERE RENTING A TWO BEDROOM HOME, YOU CAN HAVE 25, 30 PEOPLE OVER DURING THE DAYTIME, BUT THEY WOULD HAVE TO LEAVE BY I THINK IT'S 10 P.M.
BECAUSE ONLY SIX P SPEND THE NIGHT.
[01:25:03]
AND SO YOU KNOW, THOSE DAYTIME FOLKS IF YOU ARE GIVING A GREAT PARTY OR DID YOU'RE NOT, IT'S HARD TO PUSH PEOPLE OUT AFTER 10 P.M.THE NOISE ESCALATES, YOU KNOW, WHATEVER.
AND SO WHAT WE'RE PROPOSING IS TO ELIMINATE THAT AND TO HAVE JUST ONE YOU OCCUPANCY NUMBER BASED ON THE ENTIRE LENGTH OF THAT PERSON'S STAY BASED ON BEDROOMS. WE'RE LOOKING FOR FEEDBACK WHAT YOUR THOUGHTS ARE FOR THAT MANY BECAUSE OCCUPANCY IS LOOKED AT DIFFERENTLY IN EVERY CITY.
>> THE REASON I SAY THAT, LOOKING AT STR'S SOME OF THESE PROPERTIES ARE PRETTY BIG, REALLY LARGE IN SIZE.
SO THEY WOULD BE SUITABLE FOR A LARGE AMOUNT OF FOLKS BUT ALSO TAKING INTO CONSIDERATION THE NOISE AND THOSE KIND OF THINGS.
>> AND IF THE COUNCIL WANTS US TO LOOK AT TREATING THOSE LARGER PROPERTIES DIFFERENTLY, THEN PLEASE TELL US, AN SOMETHING THAT WE CAN DO AND DETERMINE HOW BEST TO APPROACH THAT.
AGAIN, WITH THE GOAL BEING TO LESSEN THE IMPACTS ON THE NEIGHBORHOOD.
I KNOW A PARTY ON A PARCEL OF PROPERTY THAT IS 12,000 SQUARE FEET, DOESN'T MATTER, IT'S BY BEDROOMS AND IF YOU DO HAVE A LARGE PROPERTY THAT HAS, I DON'T KNOW, EIGHT BEDROOMS, AND IT HAPPENS TO BE HALF A OR AN ACRE, IF THAT'S SOMETHING THAT YOU WOULD LIKE US TO EXPLORE IN TERMS OF HOW TO MANAGE OCCUPANCY THERE, THAT'S WHAT WE WOULD LIKE TO GET YOUR FEELING OR FEEDBACK ON.
>> I HAVE A FEW THOUGHTS, TELL ME IF I'M FLAWED, FOR THE LARGER PROPERTIES, THE ABILITY TO HAVE MORE PEOPLE WHETHER IT'S A BIRTHDAY PARTY, IT IS A GATHERING, IT'S A FAMILY REUNION I SAY THAT, THAT'S SOMETHING WE'RE LOOKING AT, GET TOGETHER A FAMILY REUNION, DO YOU A LOT OF THINGS OUTSID MOST OF THE FOLKS LEAVE.
SO I WOULD LIKE TO SEE SOME SPECIAL PART FOR LARGER PROPERTIES, INSTEAD OF HAVING THE OCCUPANCY TIED TO THE NUMBER OF BEDROOMS. I WOULD LIKE T THAT.
AND ON THE ONE HAND, I WOULD LIKE TO CONSIDER THAT FOR EVERYDAY PROPERTIES, HAVING SAID THAT, IF YOU ENFORCE FOR PARKING, AND YOU ENFORCE FOR NOISE, I'M NOT SURE THAT YOU'RE GOING TO BE ABLE TO HAVE MUCH MOR THAN WHAT YOU'VE YOU OUTLINED FOR THE NUMBER OF BEDROOMS. SO YOU I'M CHALLENGED WITH THAT.
INITIALLY, REPLY THOUGHT IS WE HAVE TO MAINTAIN THE QUALITY OF LIFE FOR OUR RESIDENTS.
I ALSO ENJOY THE TOURIST TRADE THAT BEHAVES THEMSELVES AND THAT MAY RENT A HOME AND MAY INVITE FAMILY OR FRIENDS, A DOZEN, RIGHT? OUT ON THE PATIO F AND THEN THEY LEAVE AT NIGHT.
I GUESS WOULD I E THAT, HAVING SAID THAT CONCERNED ABOUT THE ENFORCEMENT COMPONENT.
SO I DON'T KNOW HOW TO BRING THOSE TWO TOGETHER.
>> CAN I -- I'LL JUST -- I THINK THIS IS ONE OF THROWS SITUATIONS WHERE, WHEN THE COUNCIL GETS AROUND TO ACTUALLY CONSIDERING AN ORDINANCE, AND ADOPTING THIS, IF WE DO, WE'LL IT POSSIBLE FOR PEOPLE IN THE PUBLIC TO PROVIDE THEIR INPUT.
WE NEED TO HEAR FROM THE PEOPLE WHO ARE EXPERIENCING THESE PROBLEMS. FOR INSTANCE, ONE OF THE BIG, BIG HOUSES IN BOOKS FOR BIG EVENTS, IS RIGHT ADJACENT TO A WHOLE LINE OF SINGLE FAMILY RESIDENCES.
AND I LIVE NEARBY, I'M N ON THAT LINE BUT I LIVE DOWN THE BLOCK.
INSIDE OUR HOUSE WE CAN HEAR WHAT'S GOING ON AT THOSE PARTIES.
I CAN'T IMAGINE WHAT IT'S LIKE TO LIVE RIGHT NEXT TO IT.
NOW, ON THE OTHER HAND, THAT HOUSE WAS THERE BEFORE ANY OF THESE OTHER -- THE BIG HOUSE WAS THERE BEFORE THE OTHER HOUSES WERE BUILT.
SO WHO HAS WHAT K RIGHTS? THAT IS A POLICY ISSUE YOU'LL HAVE TO DEAL WITH.
BUT THERE ARE PEOPLE THAT HAVE SOMETHING TO SAY ABOUT THIS.
I HAVE A SITUATION, JUST TO GIVE YOU AN EXAMPLE OF HAPPENS DURING THE DAY.
[01:30:01]
I'M MORE THAN HAPPY WHEN PEOPLE AROUND ME, AND THEY'RE ALL RENTALS, I'M MORE THAN HAPPY WHEN THEY HAVE FRIENDS COME OVER TO SAY HELLO, AND VISIT WITH THEM.THAT DOESN'T BOTHER ME IN THE LEAST.
BUT WHEN SOMEBODY DECIDES THEY'RE IN TOWN WITH A BIG GROUP LET'S SAY THE LACROSSE TOURNAMENT AND THEY DECIDE THAT EACH DAY O LACROSSE TOURNAMENT OR EACH EVENING THEY'RE GOING TO HAVE A COCKTAIL PARTY AT THE HOUSE AND WE HAVE 40 OR 50 PEOPLE THAT SHOW UP ON THE BLOCK TO ATTEND THAT BACKYARD COCKTAIL PARTY, THAT'S AN IMPACT.
AND IT'S NOT ONCE, YOU K -- IF IT'S YOUR NEIGHBOR WHO HAS A WEDNESDAYING IN THEIR BACKYARD, THAT WILL HAPPEN ONCE EVERY -- MAYBE TWIC THEIR LIFETIME AND IF THEY'RE GOING TO HAVE AN ANNUAL PARTY FOR THE PEOPLE THAT THEY WORK WITH, THAT WILL HAPPEN ONCE A YEAR.
BUT IF YOU LIVE NEXT DOOR TO A HOUSE THAT'S THESE PURPOSES, IT'S EVERY WEEKEND.
AND EVERY WEEKEND HAVING A PARTY NEXT DOOR TO YOU IS A VERY DIFFERENT EXPERIENCE THAN YOU WOULD EXPECT IN A SINGLE FAMILY RESIDENTIAL NEIGHBORHOOD.
AND I THINK IT'S IMPORTANT NOT TO HEAR FROM ME.
IT'S IMPORTANT TO HEAR FROM OTHER PEOPLE IN COMMUNITY WHO ARE EXPERIENCING THAT.
IF PEOPLE LIVE IN H TOTALLY FORBID SHORT TERM RENTALS THEY MAY NOT BE EXPERIENCING THAT UNLESS THEY HAPPEN TO BE UP AGAINS ANOTHER SUBDIVISION THAT DOES.
BUT FOR PEOPLE WHO LIVE IN THOSE AREAS THAT ARE AFFECTED, THOSE ARE THE ONES WE'RE HEARING FROM.
AND THAT'S WHAT'S HAPPENED TO OTHER CITIES THEY'RE LOSING THE INDUSTRY ALTOGETHER.
WE DON'T WANT T HAPPEN IN INDIO.
SO WE WANT TO COME UP WITH POLICIES THAT MAKE IT WORK.
WHATEVER THEY ARE, WE NEED SOMETHING THAT MAKES IT WORK.
>> AND MAYBE MARK, EVEN THOUGH IT'S OUT OF ORDER MAYBE WE KIND OF HAVE THIS DISCUSSION NOW ABOUT THE SPECIAL EVENTS.
>> AND THE USE OF -- AND REALLY THAT'S THE USE OF LARGE ESTATES OR LARGE HOMES FOR SPECIAL EVENTS.
AND WHEN YOU LOOK AT A LARGE SHORT TERM RENTAL I THINK YOU HAVE TO DIFFERENTIATE BETWEEN LARGE PROPERTY THAT'S USED FOR STAY, YOU KNOW LOTS OF KIDS, WHATEVER, THEY'RE HAVING VACATION, THEY'RE ON A FIVE BEDROOM HALF ACRE LOT.
VERSUS A LARGE PROPERTY, FIVE BEDROOMS HALF ACRE YARD THAT'S BEING USED FOR A WEDDING OR A CORPORATE EVENT.
EVEN FAMILY REUNION CAN BE SOMEWHAT CORPORATE BECAUSE YOU WOULD THINK THAT WOULD GO TO A HOTEL BUT IT'S MORE ECONOMICAL TO HAVE TERM RENTAL WITH A LARGE BACKYARD.
AND THE IMPACTS OF B DIFFERENT IN THE SENSE THAT IF YOU HAVE A FAMILY DO YOU HAVE THE IMPACTS THAT WE'RE TRYING TO MITIGATE AN TRYING TO MAKE SURE THAT THAT FAMILY IS TREATING IT AS IF IT'S THEIR OWN HOME.
YOU KNOW A RESIDENTIAL USE AND THEY JUST LIKE THE LUXURY OF HAVING MORE ROOM.
VERSUS THE LARGE H BEING USED FOR A WEDDING THAT HAS 500 OR 5,000 PEOPLE THAT HAS STAGES, DJ'S FLORISTS, CAN COMMERCIAL TRUCKS THAT ARE COMING ALL THROUGH THE WEEKEND TO STAGE THIS ONE EVENT ON SATURDAY AND IT'S BEING RENTED OUT FROM THURSDAY TO TUESDAY BUT THE WHOLE PURPOSE NOR THE RENTAL IS REALLY FOR STAGING IT FOR AN EVENT.
AND SO WHAT WE'RE ASKING THE COUNCIL, AND TRYING TO GET FEEDBACK, IS YOU CAN LOOK AT IT TWO WAYS, ONE, YOU PROHIBIT IT, YOU PROHIBIT USE OF RENTAL PROPERTY FOR COMMERCIAL USE WHICH IS THE WEDDING AT A LARG ESTATE, OR WE DETERMINE A WAY TO PERMIT IT, AND CONDITIONS TO MITIGATE THE IMPACTS.
AND THE SECOND INTOSM IF THAT FIVE ACRE TRULY BEING USED AS A SHORT TERM RENTAL, SOMEBODY WANTS ROOM, SOMEBODY LIKE PICK ANY ACTOR OR ACTRESS WHO IS COMING IN FOR COACHELLA, THEY WANT TO HAVE AN ENTOURAGE WHAT, WE ARE PROPOSING IS THAT DO YOU WANT THAT FIVE ACR BEING TREATED DIFFERENTLY IF THE USE IS REALLY FOR AN OVERNIGHT STAY VERSUS A CORPORATE EVENT.
I'M HOPING YOU U THE DIFFERENT BOXES THAT I'M TRYING TO PUT THAT ONE LARGE PROPERTY IN AND THE DIFFERENT USES THAT WE'R SEEING.
AND HOW FAR YOU WANT TO GO WITH RESPECT TO THAT REGULATION.
>> BECAUSE THIS SIDE OF THE VALLEY IS LACKING IN COMMERCIAL VENUES, I THINK
[01:35:06]
IT MIGHT BE APPROPRIATE FOR US TO HAVE SOM VARIANCE OR CONDITIONAL PERMIT USED.DOESN'T NECESSARILY HAVE TO COME TO US.
COULD BE AN ADMINISTRATIVE THING, THAT IF SUCH AN OPPORTUNITY CAME UP, THAT IT COULD BE CONSIDERED FOR THAT USE.
AS LONG AS IT'S NOT IN THE RESIDENTIAL SETTINGS.
I DON'T THINK WE HAVE TO MAKE THAT DECISION.
BUT I WOULD LIKE TO SEE THERE BE SOME TYPE OF VARIANCE.
BUT I WOULD ALSO LIKE TO SEE THERE BE PARTICIPANT JUST LIKE WE HAVE THE FESTIVAL TICKET FEE.
THERE'S GOING TO BE 300 ATTENDEES AT THAT FIVE ACRE ESTATE.
BUT WE CAN GET P FEE LIKE WE DO FROM THE FESTIVAL TICKET TAX.
THE OTHER COMMENT I WANTED TO MAKE ON THE EXAMPLE THAT CITY MANAGER GAVE, BECAUSE AGAIN WE DON'T HAVE ANY VENUES HERE ON THE EASTERN COACHELLA VALLEY TO SUPPORT THESE TYPES OF EVENTS THAT ARE A BIPRODUCT OF FOR EXAMPLE THE LACROSSE OR ANY OF THE OTHER BIG EVENTS WE HAVE, WE GOING T START LOSING SOME OF THOSE EVENTS BECAUSE THEY TAKE A LOOK IN TOTALITY WHEN THEY LOOK AT A VENUE, AS TO DOES THIS AREA HAVE THE ROOM WE NEED, NOT ONLY THE BEDROOM COMMUNITY FOR SHORT TERM RENTALS FOR OUR PARTICIPANTS BUT DOUGH DO THE COMMERCIAL USES FOR THE SIDE PARTIES, SIDE THIS, THAT.
IF INDIO IS GOING TO CLOSE OFF THAT MARKET AND ON THAT REVENUE GENERATING OPPORTUNITY, I'M TALKING MORE THE COMMERCIAL SIDE, THE FIVE ACRE ESTATE NOT IN THE NEIGHBORHOODS.
WE'RE GOING TO HAVE TO COME UP WITH AN ALTERNATIVE, WE WILL LOSE THAT TO VISIT SANTA ROSA OR ANOTHER CITY BECAUSE WE HAVE NO CONTROL OVER IT.
I THINK WE'RE GOING TO HAVE TO FIND A WAY TO CAPTURE REVENUE TO SUPPORT THE ADDITIONAL COST THAT IT'S GOING TO TAKE T WHATEVER ORDINANCE THAT WE HAVE IN PLAY.
I DON'T KNOW HOW YOU'RE EVER GOING TO COUNT HOW MANY PEOPLE ARE IN A HOUSE, I MEAN, REALLY, JASON ARE YOU GOING DO GO IN TH SAY ONE TWO THREE FOUR FIVE? I DON'T KNOW HOW Y GOING TO DO THAT.
SO I'D RATHER PUT A MECHANISM INTO WE CAN GIVE THEM OPTIONS THAT DON'T DISTURB NEIGHBORHOODS AND AFFORD US AN OPPORTUNITY FOR REVENUE STREAM AND WE CAN PROVIDE ENOUGH CODE ENFORCEMENT PEOPLE TO ALLOW AS MANY PEOPLE COME TO THIS AREA AS POSSIBLE, BECAUSE WE ARE THE CITY OF FESTIVALS.
WE WANT TO ENCOURAGE TOURISM, WE DON'T WANT TO SHUT OUT THAT MARKET.
IF THEY START L THIS VEB YOU A WE HAVE HERE, THEY SAY GOT THE VENUE, GOT THE FOOD AND CATERING FOR OVERNIGHT PEOPLE, CHEC WE HAVE THE ANCILLARY FACILITIES FOR A COCKTAIL PARTY? NO CHECK.
ARE THEY GOING TO GO TO VEGAS, ARE THEY GOING TO SOMEPLACE ELSE? MAYBE SO.
SO I THINK WE NEED TO THINK ABOUT THIS FROM THE REVENUE SIDE.
NOT ONLY PROTECTING OUR RESIDENTS BUT SOMEHOW FIGURING OUT HOW WE CAN BE ON TOP OF THE SITUATION INSTEAD OF JUST BEING REACTIVE TO THE PARTY HOUSES.
LET'S KEEP THEM IN A VERY TIGHT ORDINANCE.
>> IS THAT IT MS. AMITH? OSCAR.
>> I WANTED TO BRING UP ANOTHER ISSUE I'VE BEEN AHEARING FROM RESIDENTS NOT ONLY THE NOISE COMPLAINTS BUT ALSO WE HAVE FAMILIES THAT ARE LOOKING FOR HOMES AND RIGHT NOW THOSE GETTING TAKEN UP BY THE INDUSTRY OF SHORT TERM RENTALS, RIGHT.
SO PEOPLE WHO ARE LOOKING TO BUY A HOUSE HERE IN INDIO ARE NOW HAVING TO KEEP UP WITH THE HIGHER BIDS PEOPLE THAT ARE JUST BUYING THESE HOMES TO RENT THEM OUT FULL TIME.
AND SO I THINK WE NEED TO BE CAREFUL WITH THAT AS WELL AND I WOULD EVEN RECOMMEND THAT GOING FORWARD GOING TO PROVIDE NEW PERMITS FOR SHORT TERM RENTALS THAT THOSE GO TO OWNER-OCCUPIED HOMES AND NOT HOME GOING TO BE 24-7 COMMERCIALLY RENTED OUT IN OUR NEIGHBORHOODS.
DO YOU WANT TO COMMENT ON THAT? IF YOU'D LIKE TO.
OSCAR AND I HAD A CONVERSATION ABOUT THIS EARLIER TODAY.
AND THAT IS THE OTHER SIDE OF THE COIN, WHEN TO THE SHORT TERM RENTAL BUSINESS, IS IN FACT WHEN GET TO TALKING ABOUT ADU'S THE ISSUE COMES UP THERE AS WELL.
AND THAT IS, THAT IF HOUSING IS BEING BUILT SO THAT CAN DEAL WITH CALIFORNIA'S HOUSING CRISIS, WHAT HAPPENS WHEN A COMMUNITY'S HOUSING STOCK GETS BOUGHT UP FOR
[01:40:06]
SHORT TERM RENTALS? BECAUSE THAT IS NOT A CONTRIBUTOR TO THE THE TOTAL HOUSING MARKET.THE PROBLEM WE'VE GOT IS THAT ESPECIALLY AS ALL OF OUR NEIGHBORING CITIES HAVE GOTTEN TOUGHER AND TOUGHER ON SHORT TERM RENTALS, THAT MARKET HAS BEEN DRIVEN TO INDIO BIG TIME.
AND A VAST MAJORITY, NOT CORPORATE OWNED BUT A HUGE PERCENTAGE OF THEM CERTAINLY MORE THAN HALF ARE INVESTOR-OWNED PROPERTIES.
THE IMPLICATION OF T GO TO AN OCCUPANT RENTAL SYSTEM IS VERY SEVERE AS IT RELATES TO THOSE INVESTOR-OWNED PROPERTIES.
AND THAT'S WHY I THINK OSCAR WAS SAYING A RESTRICTION WOULD HAVE TO BE PLACED ON ANY NEW ONES THAT COME INTO THE MARKET AS OPPOSE ONES THAT ARE ALREADY THERE.
BECAUSE I THINK WE'RE THINKING THAT THERE'S A LITIGATION ISSUE WITH ALL OF THIS THAT COULD BE PRETTY SEVERE.
AND FRANKLY, YOU KNOW, AS MUCH AS I WANT TO PROTECT RESIDENTS, I WANT TO PROTECT OUR BUDGET TOO, AND THERE'S A BIG IMPACT THERE AND AS LUPE SAID IT'S SUPPORTING THE CITY OF FESTIVALS IN A WAY THAT WE HAVE TO KEEP OUR EYE ON AS WELL.
THERE'S A BALANCING ACT HERE BIG TIME.
THIS ISSUE IS A ISSUE, IN CALIFORNIA IT DOES EAT UP HOUSING STOCK.
AND WE TALKED ABOUT NOT LETTING PEOPLE BUILD ADU'S FOR THE SOLE PURPOSE OF CREATING MORE RENTAL PROPERTY BECAUSE THAT DOES NOTHING TO ADDRESS THE HOUSING ISSUES THAT THE STATE TO ADOPT THEIR LEGISLATION IN THE FIRST PLACE.
BUT WE'RE NOT RECOMMENDING LIMITING IT TO OWNER-OCCUPANTS FOR ALL THOSE REASONS.
>> THERE IS A COUPLE HERE AND THE HOUSES YOU LIVE AT MONTAGE, THOSE ARE NOT -- THAT IS NOT THE TYPICAL, THAT'S CORPORATION OR INDIVIDUAL THAT DOES IT.
SOME OF THE OTHERS THAT ARE INSIDE THE GATED COMMUNITIES I'M KIND OF INTRIGUED BY YOUR THOUGHT OFF ASKING HOA FOR A LETTER OF APPROVAL.
I'VE TALKED ABOUT THIS MANY A TIME ABOUT SHORT RENTALS AND YOU TOLD ME WE COULDN'T DO IT BECAUSE OF ALL THESE THINGS.
>> HERE WE ARE ASKING IF YOU WANT THE HOA'S APPROVAL.
IF THE HOA WANTS TO STOP SHORT TERM RENTAL, THERE IS MAYBE 15 HOUSE HE LEFT IN YOUR PLACE THAT IS FULL TIME PEOPLE.
YOU WILL ALSO AT THE SAME TIME CRASH THE MARKET WHEN WE DO OIT IT'S LIKE IN CATHEDRAL CITY, ONE OF THE PROBLEMS WITH THE ARE ALSO NOW BEING LOOKED AT AS PEOPLE COMING TO THEIR PROPERTIES THERE TO COME TO OTHER PLACES AND IT'S CAUSING A VERY BIG PROBLEM THERE.
THERE'S GOT TO BE A BALANCING ACT WHICH I AGREE OF SHORT TERM RENTALS AND ABLE TO CAPTURE THEIR PROPERTIES.
MORE PEOPLE START TO DO HOAS HAVE TO START TO CLAMP DOWN ON THIS AND THE OTHER CITIES START TO DO IT, WE'RE GOING TO HAVE A SMALL AMOUNT OF RENTAL PROPERTIES AND HOTEL ROOMS DO RENT FOR LARGE EVENTS AND THAT COUL THEM TO OTHER PLACE AS.
THAT'S ONE OF THE REASONS VEGAS AND ALL THEM GO THROUGH BECAUSE THEY HAVE THE VIABILITY OF ROOMS AND THAT'S HOW THEY CAN HOST BIG EVENTS.
THAT'S WHERE WE STAND ON THIS.
IF WE DO THIS NOW, LET'S UNDERSTAND MIKE MARX THEY DECIDE THEY DON'T WANT SHORT TERM RENTALS, YOU GOING TO HAND THEM A LETTER THAT SAYS HOAS AND ALL THE PROPERTIES THAT ARE THERE NOW, THEY'RE GOING TO HAV LETTER FROM THE HOA.
>> YOU'RE GOING TO DROP OFF NOW THESE PEOPLE DON'T HAVE A SHORT TERM RENTAL, YOU'RE GOING TO FIND IT OUT VERY QUICKLY.
HERITAGE PALMS IT'S NOT ALLOWED.
ANYONE THAT'S IN THERE W BE DONE.
WOULD BE GONE BECAUSE YOU WOULDN'T -- OR THEY WOULD BE THERE ILLEGALLY, SO A LOT OF THIS IS GOING TO SHUFFLE ITS WAY OUT WHEN WE START TO PUT THE PROCESS IN PLACE TOO.
AND ONE LAST THING, ANSWER THIS FOR ME JASON, DO HAVE CODE ENFORCEMENT ON SATURDAYS AND SUNDAYS?
>> THERE IS A PROPOSAL FOR STAFF INCREASE THAT WILL INCLUDE NIGHTTIME AND WEEKEND.
>> THEY'RE NOT WORRIED ABOUT IT BECAUSE WE DON'T HAVE CODE ENFORCEMENT.
GARAGE PERMITS, WE SELL THEM MONDAY THROUGH GARAGE SALES ARE ON SATURDAY.
IF WE HAVE A STICK A CARROT WE HAVE TO MAKE SURE WE BACK IT UP WHAT WE'RE GOING TO DO.
[01:45:01]
>> THE PROPOSAL WOULD INCLUDE NIGHTTIME AND WEEKEND RESPONSE TIME TO BE ABLE TO RESPOND TO THOSE NUISANCE EVENTS.
>> IF WE HAVE THE AVAILABLE RESOURCES THAT CAN KEEP THESE PEOPLE UNDER CONTROL, AND I'LL LET THE REST OF YOU TALK HERE IN A SECOND.
I JUST WANTED TO SAY ONE THING.
LIKE IF YOU HAVE FIVE ROOMS AND YOU'RE SAYING YOU CAN HAVE TEN PEOPLE, WELL WHAT HAPPENS IF YOU HAVE RELATIVES COME DOWN FOR THA LACROSSE? YOU MIGHT HAVE A NASTY NEIGHBOR NEXT TO YOU THAT DOESN'T LIKE IT FOR WHATEVER REASON, ILLEGAL, CALLS UP, I CAN'T SAY YOU HAVE DURING THE DAY YOU HAVE TEN PEOPLE, YOU BRING YOUR FAMILIES, MULTIPLE FAMILIES, RENTING HOUSES, THEY GO ONE PLACE THAT HAVE A POOL, UNFORTUNATELY YOU CAN'T D THAT.
THAT DEFEATS THE PURPOSE OF EVEN GOING THEN.
>> AND SO YOU ALMOST WANT TO PULL BACK TO OKAY IS IT A NOISE ISSUE AND POTENTIALLY A PARK ISSUING? BECAUSE IF WE CAN M NOISE ISSUE AND THE PARKING CERTAINLY TO SOME EXTENT THEN THE OCCUPANCY DOESN'T NECESSARILY MATTER.
IF YOU HAVE 50 PEOPLE IN A TWO BEDROOM HOUSE THAT MIGHT BE A PROBLEM BECAUSE THERE IS NOISE THAT COMES WITH IT.
BUT THAT CYCLES BACK AROUND TO IT'S A NOISE PROBLEM.
AND I GUESS I W TOURISM INDUSTRY IN OUR CITY IS PRETTY NEAR AND DEAR TO OUR HEARTS BECAUSE IT BRINGS IN REVENUE NOT JUST T BUT TO THE GREATER COACHELLA VALLEY.
AND SO I ALMOST WANT TO PULL BACK AND SAY LET'S ENFORCE BASED ON NOISE ISSUES, ON ISSUES, RATHER THAN YOU CAN HAVE SIX PEOPLE IN A THREE BROOSM HOUSE.
AND THAT NUMBER STAYS STATIC THROUGHOUT THE DAY.
I'M REALLY CHALLENGED, I'D RATHER ADDRESS THE ISSUES WHICH I THINK CAN BE BETTER ADDRESSED IF YOU HAVE ADDITIONAL CODE ENFORCEMEN TO MANAGE THEM.
IT'S NOT GOING TO BE A PERFECT WORLD BUT I DON'T WANT TO SHOOT OURSELVES IN THE FOOT AND SEND TOURISM PACKING.
AND WE DIE BAITED THAT AMONG -- DEBATED THAT AMONG OURSELVES FOR A LONG TIME.
YOU KNOW, ONE O PROBLEMS IS THAT IF SOMEBODY READS AN AD, THAT SAYS THIS HOUSE WILL SLEEP 14, WHEN THEY RENT THAT HOUSE, THEY'RE COMING TO TOWN FOR A PARTY.
THAT'S WHY THEY'RE COMING TO TOWN.
THEY'RE NOT COMING TO TOWN FOR 14 PEOPLE TO SIT THE DINING ROOM TABLE AND JUST CHAT.
THEY'RE COMING TO TOWN FOR A PARTY.
AND SO YOU GIVE PEOPLE THE EXPECTATION THEY'RE DOING IS AN ACCEPTABLE THING TO DO.
AND IS A THEY'RE REALLY DOING IS THEY'RE RENTING A HOTEL, AND GOING TO -- COMING THE INDIO FOR THE WEEKEND TO DO WHAT YO DO IN A HOTEL WITH YOUR FRIENDS.
BUT IT'S CHEAPER AND I SIMPLER.
AND IF THAT'S AN ACCEPTABLE THING TO DO, THAT'S FINE.
BUT I THINK THAT'S GOING TO LEAVE US WITH AN ENFORCEMENT PROBLEM THAT IS EVEN BIGGER.
IF WE -- IF WE H LIMITATIONS, ON WHAT PEOPLE CAN HAVE IN THE HOUSE, IF WE TELL THEM UP FRONT, YOU CAN BRING ALL THOSE PEOPL YOU WANT TO BRING, YOU'RE GOING TO GET THEM.
I MEAN I'VE SEEN 12 CARS SQUEEZED ON TO ONE LOT.
STICKING ALL OVER T AND EVERYTHING.
BECAUSE THE HOA DOESN'T LET YOU PARK IN THE STREET, RIGHT? BUT THEY'RE ALL COMING AND THEY'RE COMING TO THE PARTY THAT THEY CAME TO TOWN FOR.
SO IF WE WANT TO DEAL WITH PARTY HOUSES IF THE ONLY THING WE HAVE TO DO IS A CODE ENFORCEMENT DEPARTMENT THAT COMES OUT TO TELL THEM TO BE QUIETER THEY'RE GOING TO HAVE TO DO THAT WEEKEND.
BECAUSE IT'S NOT GOING TO BE THE SAME PEOPLE TOLD LAST WEEKEND, IT'S GOING DONE SOMEBODY ELSE SOMEBODY ELSE AND SOMEBODY ELSE, THAT'S WHY WE TRIED PUT LIMITATIONS TO GIVE PEOPLE THE EXPECTATION THAT THAT'S ALL THEY CAN DO.
IF SOMEBODY CAME AND HAD 14 PEOPLE AND THEY MAKING NOISE NO ONE'S EVER GOING TO CALL IT IN, NO ANSWER EVER GOING TO COMPLAIN AND THERE IS NOT ENFORCEMENT PROBLEM.
IF 14 PEOPLE ARE COMING IN AND HAVING A LOT OF RACKET THEY'RE GOING TO HAVE AN ENFORCEMENT ISSUE.
>> I DON'T THINK ANYONE IS GOING TO DISPUTE QUALITY OF LIFE.
THEY SHOULD BE ABLE TO ADVERTISE THAT ANYWAYS.
THAT'S SOMETHING WE NEED TO CLAMP DOWN ON, BECAUSE I HAVE SEEN THOSE THINGS.
[01:50:02]
YES, YOU ARE RIGHT, I DO AGREE WITH YOU 100%, THERE ARE A GROUP USING LACROSSE AS AN EXAMPLE.THEY ARE ALL INDIVIDUAL FAMILIES, THEY ARE GATHERING TOGETHER TO DO SOMETHING.
YOU ARE PENALIZING GOOD PEOPLE WITH THIS AT THE SAME TIME WITH THE OTHER ONE.
I DO AGREE WITH YOU, IF I SAYS 14 COME IN AND DO IT, MOST INDIVIDUALS IN A FOUR BEDROOM HOUSE IS NOT GOING TO SLEEP 14 PEOPLE, YOU NOT GOING THERE FOR A FAMILY GATHERING, YOU'RE GOING THERE FOR A PARTY.
BUT IT DOES OLIMIT PEOPLE SAYING YOU CAN'T COME OVER TO THE HOUSE AS A GROUP OF US, YOU CAN'T HAVE MORE THAN TEN PEOPLE HERE, EVEN THOUGH YOU DRIVE BACK TO A HOUSE THAT IS 100 FEET AWAY OR 200 FEET AWAY, YOU CAN'T COME HERE.
THAT'S WHERE THAT KIND OF LOSES ME, IT'S LIKE OKAY FOR THE FEW BAD PEOPLE, THERE ARE A LOT OF OTHER PEOPLE THAT DO DO THIS, KNOW HOW WE GET OTHAT BALANCE.
THAT'S WHY I SAID YOU ARE GOING TO EVENTUALLY NEED TO TALK TO THE PEOPLE WHO ARE AFFECTED BY THIS.
AND THERE MAY BE OTHER SOLUTIONS TO SOME OF THIS.
I DON'T THINK THAT JUST CODE ENFORCEMENT ALONE IS GOING TO BE THE ANSWER TO YOUR PROBLEM.
>> I AGREE WE NEED TO PUT SOME PARAMETERS IN PLACE BUT HOW BIG THEY ARE AND WHAT THEY ARE IS GOING TO BE THE DIFFERENCE.
WE VBTD TRIED CODE ENFORCEMENT ON WEEKEND.
YOU KNOW WE DON'T HAVE ANYBODY ON SATURDAY AND SUNDAY.
THERE IS NOT ANYBODY TO RESPOND TO THIS, IT GETS REALLY BAD, GETS WORSE AND WORSE AND WORSE AND WORSE, ONLY TIME WE HAVE I HAVE JIM CURTIS, JIM IS THE ONE WHO GETS THE CALL, THAT'S THE ONLY DIFFERENCE ON THAT IS YOU DO KNOW, BUT ANY GOOD OWNER THAT'S BEEN HERE A LONG TIME KNOWS WE DON'T HAVE ANYTHING ON SATURDAY AND SUNDAY SO.
WHAT THEY DO IS GET A T IN THE MAIL TWO OR THREE DAYS LATER WHATEVER GOES ON AND THE OTHER PEOPLE HAVE ALREADY GONE.
>> I WANTED TO SAY I AGREE MORE WITH THE CURRENT LIMITATION THAT ALLOW A LITTLE BIT MORE OF THE OCCUPANTS IN THE HOME ON THE ROOMS. I THINK THE NEW ONES ARE A LITTLE TOO RESTRICTIVE.
I DO AGREE WITH MS. RAMOS AMITH, HAVING A PROGRAM FOR LARGER EVENTS, AREAS THAT CAN ACCOMMODATE MORE PEOPLE DIFFERENT THAN SHORT TERM RENTAL LIMITS OF OCCUPANTS.
MY QUESTION IS WHAT IS THE SOLUTION TO WILLING TO ADDRESS THAT SHORT TERM RENTAL ISSUE?
>> I THINK HOAS THEMSELVES ARE ADDRESSING IT BY NOT ALLOWING SHORTS TERM RENTALS.
>> HOW DO WE EXTEND THAT PROTECTION TO OTHER NEIGHBORHOODS WHO DON'T HAVE HOA'S?
>> IT'S REALLY OUT OF OUR LEGAL ARM BECAUSE IT'S A PROPERTY RIGHTS ISSUE WE DON'T HAVE JURISDICTION ON THAT.
>> I AGREE ABOUT HAVING A SEPARATE PROGRAM FOR LARGER EVENTS.
YOU KNOW THE AREAS THAT CAN ACCOMMODATE FOR PEOPLE, DIFFERENT THAN THE SHORT-TERM RENTAL LIMITS OF THE OCCUPANTS.
MY QUESTION, THOUGH, IS WHAT IS OUR SOLUTION TO INVESTORS BUYING UP THE HOUSING SUPPLY? IF WE ARE NOT WILLING TO GO WITH THE OWNER- ISSUES?
>> H.O.A.S ARE ADDRESSING THEM NOT ALLOWI SHORT-TERM RENTALS.
>> HOW DO WE EXTEND IT TO THE OTHER NEIGHBORHOODS THAT DON'T HAVE THE H.O.A.S?
>> THAT IS REALLY OUT OF OUR LEGAL ARM, BECAUSE IT'S A PROPERTY RIGHTS ISSUE.
DON'T HAVE JURISDICTION OVER THAT.
>> I THINK WHAT WE NEED TO IS WHAT WE ARE DOING.
GET THE $6 MILLION THAT THE STATE GOVERNMENT OWES US FOR THE HOUSING AUTHORITY TO PUT IN.
THE OTHER THING WHAT WE NEED DO IS START PARTNERING WITH THE COACHELLA HOUSING COALITION, COMPLEXES AND ALLOW OTHER DIFFERENT VARIETIES OF THE MANUFACTURED HOMES AND THAT, STARTER HOMES AND START TO MOVE SOME OF THOSE OUT TO THE UNINCORPORATED AREAS THAT WE BRING IN THE CITY.
OR UP ON THE NORTH SIDE IN CERTAIN AREAS AND ALLOW MOBILE HOME PARKS AND TOWNHOMES AND ENCOURAGE THAT SO PEOPLE CAN GET A FIRST-TIME HOME AND EXPAND TO THE OTHER.
WE NEED A BETTER RANGE OF HOMES AVAILABLE.
EVEN IF THE HOME IS $300,000 THAT IS OUT OF THE REACH OF A LOT OF RESIDENTS.
HOW DO WE GET HOMES THAT ARE CHEAPER AND MORE AFFORDABLE TO START? I AGREE.
THAT IS SOMETHING WE HAVE TO DO.
I DON'T KNOW IF SHORT-TERM RENTALS WILL TO STOP PEOPLE BUYING THE HOMES.
YOU HAVE TO PUT $80,000 TO $100,000 DOWNS AND WE NEED ALTERNATIVES.
BACK IN THE DAY, SOME OF THE MOBILE HOME PARKS IF YOU LOOK IN THE INNER PART OF THE CITY, WE HAVE BEAUTIFUL ONES IN THE AREA BUT WE DON'T ALLOW IT ANYMORE.
I DON'T KNOW WHEN THE LAST MOBILE HOME PARK HAS BEEN HERE BUT EVERYONE DESERT GROVE IS A COMMUNITY.
BUT WE ALSO HAVE AREAS HERE EVEN IN THE LOW AREAS BOUGHT OUT BY THE SHORT-TERM RENTAL INDUSTRY.
[01:55:02]
SO EVEN HOMES $250,000 AND $300,000 GET HIGHER BIDS FROM PEOPLE IN THE INDUSTRY AND THAT IS TAKING AWAY FROM THE HOUSING SUPPLY F FAMILIES.>> I HAVE NOT SEEN THAT IN THOSE PARTS BUT I IMAGINE.
THE PRICE OF HOUSING IS UP 28% OVER WHAT PRICE WAS BECAUSE OF COVID.
ANYTHING ELSE, OSCAR? I APOLOGIZE.
>> I THINK WE HAVE, AT LEAST I UNDERSTAND WHERE YOU WANT TO SEE SOME CHANGES AND SOME FLEXIBILITY BETWEEN THE BALANCE THAT ALL TRYING TO REACH.
I THINK WE HAVE SOME WORK TO DO IN THAT ARE BACK TO YOU.
THANK YOU FOR THE SPIRITED DISCUSSION AND FOR LETTING ME PARTICIPATE.
THAT IS WHAT WE WANTED WAS THE COUNCIL INPUT.
WE ARE HEARING WHAT YOU HAVE GOT TO SAY.
>> DO WE WANT TO FINISH THE PRESENTATION?
WE'LL FINISH THE PRESENTATION.
>> SHE WILL PUT UP THE SHARE SCREEN.
SO OUR NEXT TOPIC OF DISCUSSION REALLY IS A CONFIRMATION WITH RESPECT TO ACCESSORY DWELLING UNITS.
STATE LAW DOES ALLOW CITIES TO PROHIBIT SH RENTALS IN A.D.U.S AND THE J.A.D.U.S, JUNIOR ACCESSORY DWELLING UNITS.
THE CITY'S CURRENT, THE ORDINANCE WE JUST ADOPTED DOES PROHIBIT LESS THAN 30-DAY RENTALS IN A.D.U.S AND JUNIOR A.D.U.S.
SO MOVING FORWARD, OUR PROPOSAL IS NOT TO P SHORT-TERM RENTALS IN A.D.U.S AND JUNIOR A.D.U.S.
I MEAN I THINK PART OF THE CONCEPT WHEN YOU LOOK AND WE WERE DISCUSSING THIS INTERNALLY AND I THINK OSCAR AND BOTH MAYOR MILLER H BROUGHT IT UP THAT THE PURPOSE FOR THE A.D.U.S JADUS IS HOUSING STOCK AND ALTERNATIVE MEAN OF HOUSING.
SO WANTING TO PROTECT THAT AND WE HAVE WIT ORDINANCE AND WE WILL DO IT ON THE BACK END WITH THIS ORDINANCE.
THE CURRENT ORDINANCE DOES NOT HAVE A MIN STAY.
SO, YOU CAN HAVE SOMEBODY SEVEN DIFFERENT IT SEVEN DIFFERENT NIGHTS OF THE WEEK.
SO WHAT WE ARE PROPOSING IS RECOMMENDING AT LEAST A TWO-NIGHT MINIMUM STAY.
SOME CITIES HAVE A THREE NIGHT.
I DON'T KNOW IF ANY HAVE FOUR BUT SOME H NIGHTS.
SO WE WANTED TO GET YOUR FEEDBACK ON THAT.
AGAIN, TO PREVENT RENTERS CIRCULATING ON THE SAME PIECE OF PROPERTY CONTINUOUSLY IMPACTS NEIGHBORHOOD.
AND SO, WHEN YOU HAVE A RENTER THAT HAS T THERE A LITTLE BIT LONGER, THERE IS LESS THROUGHOUT THE WEEK.
THAT IS, I GUESS, THE THINKING WITH RESPEC THAT.
I DON'T KNOW IF COUNCIL HAS A PREFERENCE OR LEAVE IT THE WAY IT IS NOW.
THAT IS WHAT WE ARE LOOKING FOR FROM THE COUNCIL.
>> YOU HAVE A COMMENT FROM THE PUBLIC?
>> NO, LUPE HAS SOMETHING TO SAY.
>> I WOULD PREFER THE TWO-NIGHT STAY MINIMUM.
BUT I WANTED TO COMMENT ON THE A.D.U.S AN SHORT-TERM RENTALS.
THE SHORT-TERM RENTALS WOULD BE CONTRADICT PURPOSE OF A.D.U.S AND JADUS BUT WHAT IF A MAIN UNIT BECOMES A SHORT-TE AND THE MASTER RESIDENT MOVES IN THE A.D.U.
OR THE JADU FOR THE WEEKEND? IS THAT PROHIBITED?
>> THAT IS THE ISSUE WE ARE HAVING NOW.
I THINK OUR GOAL IS TO TRY TO FIND A WAY THAT WOULD BE -- IT'S HARD BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, IF THE A.D.U.
-- IF SOMEBODY BUILDS AN ACCESSORY DWELLING UNIT AND THEY LEAVE IT VACANT AND THEY DON'T RENT IT FOR A SHORT-TERM RENTAL AND THEY USE IT FOR THEIR OWN PERSONAL USE IT IS HARD TO REGULATE AND LEGISLATE HAVING THE HOMEOWNER OF THE PROPERTY TO FACILITATE THEIR OWN USE OF THEIR OW PROPERTY.
SO I THINK THAT IS A TOUGHER AREA TO REGULATE.
IF THEY CHOOSE TO RENT OUT THEIR MAIN HOUSE OF THE OCCUPANCY AND, OF
[02:00:01]
COURSE, WE NEED TO REWORK THAT, WE WOULDN'T ALLOW TH A.D.U.NOT TO BE USED AS A SHORT-TERM RENTAL AND COUNT TOWARD OCCUPANCY FORMULA.
BUT I THINK IT'S HARD-PRESSED FOR US TO PREVENT A HOMEOWNER FROM USING THEIR ACCESSORY DWELLING UNIT FOR THEIR OWN OVERNIGHT AND LIVING PURPOSES, EVEN IF IT'S JUST FOR A WEEKEND.
THAT IS WHAT MAKES WHAT JASON'S DEALING WI ENFORCEMENT END VERY DIFFICULT.
YOU KNOW, WITH THE A.D.U.S, THERE IS NO REQUIRED PARKING NOW UNDER THE STATE LAW.
THEN WE START TO LOOK AT REGULATING THE PARKING BECAUSE NOW YOU HAVE THE HOMEOWNER'S CARS GET COUNTED TOWARD REALLY THE NUMB THE PARKING SPACES THAT ARE LEFT FOR THE RENTER OF MAIN HOUSE.
IF YOU CAN'T FIT -- I'LL JUST MAKE UP FOR EIGHT CARS ON YOUR PROPERTY, THEN FROM THE NEW PERSPECTIVE THAT IS A VIOLATION IF THEY ARE PARKED SOMEWHERE ELSE.
>> SO WE ARE ASSUMING THAT ALL THE RESIDE CAR? ALL THE OCCUPANTS HAVE A CAR?
>> I'M JUST MAKING A NUMBER UP.
>> FOR EXAMPLE, IF WE HAVE FOUR BEDROOM AN EIGHT OCCUPANTS ARE WE ASSUMING THAT THERE HAS TO BE EIGHT PARKING SPOTS?
IF THEY LIVE THERE THE ASSUMPTION SHORT-TERM RENTAL, IF THEY USE IT FOR THE RENTAL AND THEY HAVE AN ACCESSORY DWELLING UNIT THEY MOVE IN TO FOR THE WEEKEND TO RENT THEIR MAIN HOUSE, IF THAT, IF THEY HAVE THE EIGHT PARKING SPACES AVAILABLE ON THE PROPERTY, WE LOOK IN TERMS OF PARKING BOTH THE A.D.U.
BECAUSE THE OWNER IS LIVING THERE FOR THE WEEKE WELL, AND HOW MANY CARS THE RENTER BRINGS.
THE RENTER NEEDS TO BE ABLE TO FIT, PARK ALL OF THEIR CARS ON THE PROPERTY.
IT'S DIFFERENT FOR EVERY PROPERTY.
YOU MAY HAVE SOME PROPERTIES THAT CAN ACCOMMODATE THAT AND YOU MAY HAVE SOME PROPERTIES THAT CAN'T.
SO THEN THEY WOULD BE IN VIOLATION IF THEY CAN'T.
SO HOPEFULLY THAT ANSWERED YOUR QUESTION.
>> I DON'T KNOW IF THAT IS A JOKE OR NOT.
>> NO, I WASN'T TRYING TO BE RUDE.
THAT IS WHAT YOU HAVE TO WORK WITH.
>> THAT IS WHAT WE ARE THINKING.
>> IRENEING MORE TOWARD SUPPORTING THE USE OF THE A.D.U.
-- I'M LEANING MORE SUPPORTING THE USE OF THE A.D.U.
IT WILL PROVIDE ADDITIONAL INCOME FOR LOCAL RESIDENTS WHO MIGHT HAVE THE SPACE IN THEIR BACKYARD AND KEEP UP WITH THE RISING R CITY.
AND FOR THE MAXIMUM NUMBER OF THE NIGHTS, I JUST DON'T WANT TO LIMIT THE RESIDENTS TO HAVING TWO OR MORE NIGHTS JUST BECAUSE IT MIGHT REDUCE THE AMOUNT OF THE RENTALS THEY ARE ABLE TO ACCOMMODATE FOR DURING THE YEAR.
>> MY TWO CENTS IS I THINK I WOULD SUPPORT THE TWO-NIGHT MINIMUM STAY.
GOSH, IF IT'S ONE NIGHT, FIND A HOTEL.
BUT I THINK THE TWO-NIGHT MINIMUM STAY MIGHT HELP ALLEVIATE IT.
>> ANYBODY ELSE WITH COMMENTS?
TO ME I THINK IT LIMITS THE ABILITY, A LOT OF PEOPLE WANT TO COME IN AND THEY DON'T WANT TO HOTEL AND RENT AIRBNB AND GO.
I DO IT MYSELF WHEN I GO TO PLACES.
I STAY THERE MOSTLY THAN I STAY AT HOTELS.
I ENJOY THE KITCHEN AND ALL THE OTHER STUFF WITH IT.
I LOOK AT IT A LITTLE DIFFERENTLY.
>> I THINK, TOO, AS WE CONTINUE TO GROW IN COMMUNITY AS FAR AS, YOU KNOW, OUR DETENTION OUR C.O.D., THERE WILL BE MORE OPPORTUNITIES FOR THE FOLKS TO COME IN AND MAYBE STAY ONE NIGHT.
MEDICAL PERSONNEL, YOU KNOW, SO I'M NOT IN FAVOR OF THE TWO-DAY MINIMUM.
CAN YOU PUT ME BACK TO SHARE SCREEN?
>> GO BACK TO SHARE SCREEN? HOW MANY MORE SLIDES DO WE HAVE?
>> WE'LL GET IN TO THE FINES AND FEES.
>> I'LL TURN IT OVER TO JASON.
SO WHEN WE LOOK AT PROPOSED FINES AND FEES, OUR PROPOSAL IS ACTUALLY SIGNIFICANTLY LESS THAN OUR NEIGHBORING VALLEY CITIES.
ON THE HIGH END, SOME CITIES CHARGE FINES OF $5,000, $10,000, $15,000.
IN MY EXPERIENCE THE HIGHER THE FINE GOES, THE HARDER IS IT TO COLLECT AND THE HARDER IT IS TO ENFORCE.
YOU JUST SORT OF ANTAGONIZE THE COMMUNITY.
OUR PROPOSAL IS TO REDUCE THE FINE DOWN TO $500 LEVEL.
IT'S 75% LESS THAN ALL THE REST OF THE VALLEY CITIES.
50% LESS THAN OUR CURRENT FINE.
WE THINK THAT IS ENOUGH INCENTIVE FOR PEOPLE NOT TO VIOLATE THE LAW, TO GET THE
[02:05:20]
PERMIT, TO DO THE RIGHT THING.IT'S NOT SO HIGH THAT WE ARE GOING TO LITIGATE IT FOR YEARS AND IT WILL COST US THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS IN THE LEGAL FEES TO ENFORCE FINE AMOUNT.
THE PROPOSAL TO HAVE A FINE FOR NOT HAVING PERMIT.
FOR OCCUPANCY, VIOLATIONS, AGAINST THE OWNER, THE FIRST OFFENSE WOULD BE A WARNING.
SO IT'S A LEGISLATIVE WARNING.
SO WE HAVE TO ISSUE IT ONE-TIME IN THE PERMIT TERM.
THE FIRST TIME WE FINE TOO MANY PEOPLE ON OUR PROPERTY IT'S A WARNING.
OFFICIAL WARNING TO THE OWNER.
THE OCCUPANT COULD GET FINED $250.
THE SECOND OFFENSE IN THE PERMIT TERM, THE OR THE OWNER WOULD GET A $500 FINE.
THE OCCUPANT WOULD BE A PROGRESSIVE $250, $500 OR $1,000 DEPENDING HOW LONG THEY ARE THERE.
AFTER THAT, IT WOULD BE $1,000 EVERY TIME TERMINATION OF THE PERMIT.
WE WOULD GO THROUGH THE PROCESS TO TERMINA PERMIT.
FOR THE COMMERCIAL EVENTS, SIMILAR, IF A COMMERCIAL ENTERPRISE COMES IN AND RENTS IT, IT'S FINE AND THEN THE OWNER IS $500 $1,000.
FOR THE TECHNICAL VIOLATIONS, THE PARKIN LOUD MUSIC >>> THOSE TYPES OF ISSUES, RENTERS GET FINED.
OWNERS GET A WARNING IN THE PERMIT TERM.
AND IT'S CAPPED AT $200 AFTER THAT.
WE ARE ALSO GOING TO PROPOSE A RESPONSE FEE.
SO ALONG WITH THE FINE IF WE GO OUT AND VE VIOLATION HAS OCCURRED, OUR PROPOSAL IS TO FINE PLUS A FEE FOR OUR RESPONSE.
THE FIRST RESPONSE WE DO ALONG WITH THE W CONCEPT IS GOING TO BE NO CHARGE TO THE OWNER.
EVERY TIME AFTER THAT, $286 FEE ASSOCIATED RESPONSE.
>> WHERE ARE WE AT NOW? BECAUSE WE ARE TALKING ABOUT ADDING MORE STAFF.
IF WE ARE DROPPING FEES, I MEAN, THIS DOES SERVICE AS A DETERRENT, HOPEFULLY.
BUT IF WE ARE ADDING MORE STAFF, WHERE IS T COMING FROM?
>> THAT IS GOING TO BE -- WE WILL TALK ABOUT THAT ON THE NEXT PAGE.
THIS IS PURELY A RESPONSE TO A NUISANCE OR THE VIOLATION.
RIGHT NOW WE DON'T CHARGE A RESPONSE FEE.
TECHNICAL VIOLATIONS FOR LIKE LOUD PARTY WOULD BE $500.
THE ONLY $1,000 PENALTY WE HAVE CURRENTLY OPERATING WITHOUT A PERMIT.
THAT IS ALSO ASSOCIATED WITH THE GRACE PERIOD.
SO YOU CAN GET $1,000 FINE BUT YOU HAVE A TIME FRAME TO COME IN COMPLIANCE.
MOST PEOPLE TAKE THE AD DOWN AND CALL US AND WE WILL MAKE THE FINE GO AWAY.
WE ARE HOPING TO TIGHTEN THAT UP FOR INCENTIVE.
BUT REDUCE THE OVERALL AMOUNT OF THE FINE WE ISSUE.
ANY QUESTIONS OR DISCUSSION ON THAT? TOWARD THE END OF THE PRESENTATION, I MOVE IT TO THE END BUT I HAVE A COMPARISON TO OTHER VALLEY CITIES.
IF YOU ARE INTERESTED TO SEE IT NOW.
>> THE FINE AND PENALTY COMPARISON TO THE VALLEY CITIES.
THIS IS THE CURRENT FINE SCHEDULE.
SO IF YOU WANT TO GO OVER NO PERMITS INDIO CHARGES THE $1,000 PENALTY.
TAKE YOUR AD DOWN, GET YOUR PERMIT.
YOU DON'T HAVE TO PAY THE FINE.
PALM SPRINGS, THEY DON'T HAVE THAT.
IN FACT WE ARE THE ONLY CITY THAT HAS A GRACE PERIOD CONCEPT ON THE FINE SCHEDULE.
PALM SPRINGS, $5,000, $10,000.
CATHEDRAL CITY, THIS IS NEW AND IT GOES IN BELIEVE ON FRIDAY.
CATHEDRAL CITY OPERATING WITHOUT A PERMIT.
RANCHO MIR RAN, $5,000, $10,000.
LA QUINTA, $1,000, $1,500, $2,000.
THIS IS SIGNIFICANTLY LOWER THAN THE VALLEY THE HIGH FINES DON'T EQUAL COMPLIANCE IN MY EXPERIENCE.
FOR TECHNICAL VIOLATIONS OUR CURRENT THE $500.
[02:10:01]
PALM SPRINGS AS YOU CAN SEE THE $500, $1,000, $2,500.CATHEDRAL CITY IS $1,000, $3,000, $5,000.
THAT IS CONSISTENT WITH MOST VALLEY CITIES.
SO THE OVERALL FINE SCHEDULE WE ARE GOING TO PROPOSAL IS SIGNIFICANTLY LESS.
I THINK THAT IS THE POINT WE WANT TO HIT ON.
I THINK THE $500 ON OUR EXPERIENCE IS ABOUT THE SPOT WHERE WE NEED TO BE TO COMPEL COMPLIANCE WITHOUT ANTAGONIZING PROPERTY OWNERS.
>> I JUST WANT TO DOUBLE CHECK SOMETHING.
OUR RENEWAL PERMIT FEE THAT WE ARE PROPOSING IS WHAT?
>> IS THERE A PAGE WHERE THAT IS?
>> I THINK WE WERE GOING TO TALK ABOUT THAT.
THERE IS NOT A PAGE ABOUT THAT.
I DON'T KNOW IF WE CAME UP WITH THE NUMBER YET.
>> THAT IS A BIG PART OF WHAT PAYS FOR T STAFF.
SO LET'S GO BACK TO THAT, ACTUALLY.
>> IS THERE A REASON WE DON'T HAVE A NO GRACE PERIOD OR TAKE DOWN THE AD IF THEY ARE NOT DOING IT? I UNDERSTAND YOU WANT THEM TO COMPLY.
BUT THERE HAS TO BE A CARROT WITH THE STICK.
NO GRACE PERIOD, IF THEY GET CAUGHT AND KNOW IT, THEY SHOULD PAY LIKE EVERYONE ELSE DOES.
HOW LONG HAVE THEY BEEN DOING IT WHERE THEY BEEN COLLECTING FEES AND NOT PAYING US? SO THERE IS NO GRACE PERIOD.
EVERYBODY SHOULD KNOW THEY SHOULD HAVE TO HAVE A PERMIT FOR A SHORT-TERM RENTAL.
IF NOT, THEY ARE TAKING A CHANCE.
THEY COULD HAVE MADE $10,000, COMING IN PAYING THE PERMIT THEY ALREADY HAD TO DO DOESN'T INCENTIVIZE THEM NOT TO.
>> THAT IS WHY THE PROPOSAL IS ELIMINATING PERIOD FOR THAT.
>> LET'S GO BACK TO THE DISCUSSION ON WHAT IT WILL TAKE TO ENFORCE THAT AND A RANGE OF FEES FOR PERMITS AND RENEWALS.
BASED ON THE CURRENT COUNT OF THE 749 RENTALS.
WE THINK IT WILL TAKE FOUR CODE ENFORCEMEN MEMBERS.
SUPERVISOR DEMANDS THE PROGRAM.
TO RESPOND TO ALL THE COMPLAINTS, THROUGHOUT THE WEEKEND AND THE NIGHTS.
AND PROCESSING AND THE INSPECTIONS.
I HEARD ROB EARLIER WHO THREW OUT A NUMBER OF $754.
ON THE FEE SCHEDULE? SOMETHING IN THAT RANGE.
SO WE ARE LOOKING AT RAISING THE FEES TO SO BETWEEN $500 TO $750.
IT'S CONSISTENT WITH MOST CITIES.
IF WE WANT TO MOVE FORWARD WE CAN TALK ABOUT THAT.
YOU CAN SEE THE CURRENT FEE SCHEDULE FOR VALLEY CITIES.
>> WE'D BE LOOKING AT A SUBSTANTIAL INCREASE.
BUT WHAT WE ARE DOING TODAY IS ALMOST NOTHING.
WHEN YOU PUT IT IN TO THE CONTEXT OF HOW MUCH PEOPLE ARE MAKING OFF OF THESE RENTALS, IT'S REALLY NOT A BIG FEE.
WE ARE TALKING ABOUT BEING HALF OF WHAT CATHEDRAL CITY AND LESS THAN HALF OF WHAT PALM SPRINGS IS.
DOES ANYONE HAVE DISCUSSION, QUESTIONS?
>> I CAN'T SEE ANYBODY ON THIS SIDE.
I LIKE THE LOOK AT WHAT WE HAVE NOW THAT IS PROPOSED TO REALLY TAKE THIS IN TO CONSIDERATION.
I MEAN OUR FEES ARE STANLEY LOWER THAN EVERYONE ELSE.
I'M IN SUPPORT OF RAISING THOSE.
-- OUR FEES ARE SUBSTANTIALLY LOWER THAN EVERYONE ELSE.
I'M IN SUPPORT OF RAISING THOSE.
FOLKS KNOW WHAT THE FINES ARE.
IF YOU ARE OPERATING LAWFULLY AND WITHIN CONSTRAINTS OF THE S.T.R.
PROGRAM YOU SHOULDN'T HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT THE FINES.
I'M NOT IN FAVOR OF LOWERING ANY OF THE FINES.
ANYBODY ELSE? OSCAR, GO AHEAD.
>> I THINK YOU KNOW FOR THE PERMIT FEES I DO SEE THE INCREASE AS NECESSARY.
I'M JUST WONDERING IF THERE CAN BE A SCALE BASED ON THE NUMBER OF THE OCCUPANTS THAT YOU ARE ALLOWED IN THE RESIDENCE? I KNOW SOME OF THE SHORT-TERM RENTALS WI RENTED OUT FOR A MUCH LARGER SUM THAN OTHER RENTALS WILL BE.
THE OTHER SUGGESTION I WANT TO SEE IS IF WE CAN GET AWAY WITH NOT ADDING THE SUPERVISOR POSITION AND JUST ADDING THE TWO CODE ENFORCEMENT OFFICERS AND THE TECHNICIAN TO HAVE THEM FALL UNDER THE CURRENT LEADERSHIP IN THE CODE ENFORCEMENT DEPARTMENT.
I'M NOT SURE IF THE EXTRA SUPERVISOR NECESSARY.
[02:15:06]
THAT IS ALL.>> CHIEF? YOU WANTED TO SAY SOMETHING?
>> AT SOME POINT, I THINK JASON IS GOING TO NEED A DAY OFF.
SO IT REALLY ISN'T, I MEAN IT'S TWO SEPARA BECOMES TWO SEPARATE FUNCTIONS FOR CODE ENFORCEMENT.
EVERYTHING THEY DO NOW AND THEN PEELING OFF SHORT-TERM RENTAL STUFF.
SO, I HAVE A MAJOR CONCERN ABOUT SENDING PE WEEKENDS WITH NO SUPERVISORY STAFF.
>> WE ARE NOT LOOKING FOR AN ANSWER OF ANY OF THAT TODAY.
IT WILL BE ON THE BUDGET BOARD.
>> I HAVE ANOTHER QUESTION, AS FAR AS THE NOISE.
WHEN WE RESPOND TO THE NOISE COMPLAINTS, RESPONDING IDENTICAL TO A RESIDENT? YOU KNOW, WHAT IS THE CONTRAST S.T.R.
VERSUS A RESIDENTIAL HOME? BECAUSE WE MIGHT HAVE A COMPLAINT FROM AN S.T.R.
CITY WISE, DO WE HAVE ANY KIND OF ORDINAN ORDINANCE IN PLACE TO WHERE WE HAVE A CERTAIN YOU HAVE TO TURN THE MUSIC DOWN?
>> CURRENTLY, WE DO HAVE A RESPONSE.
LOUD PARTY RESPONSE PROTOCOL FOR HOMEOWNER PROPERTIES.
WE USUALLY GET A COMPLAINT, WE RESPOND.
THERE IS A LOUD PARTY NOTICE ISSUED.
PARKING, LOUD MUSIC, ANY OF THE BYPRODUCTS NUISANCE PARTY.
IF WE RESPOND BACK OUT THE SECOND TIME, THERE IS A FINE ASSOCIATED WITH THAT RESPONSE.
I AGREE WITH INCREASING THE FEES BOTH FOR FINES AND FOR THE ACTUAL PERMIT.
YOU KNOW, STAFF MAY FEEL THAT WE NEED TO BE CONSERVATIVE IN OUR APPROACH FOR INCREASING THESE BUT WHEN I TAKE A LOOK AT HOW MUCH OUR NEIGHBOR IS CHARGING -- YOU DON'T HAVE COACHELLA ON HERE.
I WONDER WHAT COACHELLA'S FEES ARE.
I WOULD LIKE TO SEE A TWO-STEPPED APPROACH TO MOVE TO THE $750 RANGE IN THE NEXT FISCAL CYCLE.
BUT ONCE PROPERTY OWNERS START RENEWING, KNOW THAT THE NEXT FISCAL CYCLE WE ARE GOING IT UP AND HAVE ANOTHER STAGE.
BECAUSE WE ARE WAY BEHIND THE CITY OF LA QUINTA.
I THINK WE HAVE MUCH BIGGER POOL OF SHORT-TERM RENTALS.
WE SHOULD BE PRETTY COMPARABLE WITH THE C LA QUINTA WHEN IT COMES TO THE ACTUAL PERMIT SHORT-TERM RENTAL.
ON THE NOISE, THE NOISE VARIANCE OR THE NOI HOW DO WE MEASURE SOMEBODY COMPLAINS AND CALLS? I KNOW WE GET THESE AT THE MUSEUM.
I CAN HEAR IT THREE BLOCKS DOWN THE STREET.
WHAT IS THE PARAMETER TO DETERMINE THE NOISE LEVEL, TOO HIGH OR NOT TOO HIGH?
>> CURRENTLY, IT'S THE REASONABLE PERSON STANDARD.
SO A LOUD MUSIC TO A REASONABLE PERSON 50- AWAY FROM THE PROPERTY.
>> IS THERE ANY OF US ON THE DAIS THAT IS A REASONABLE PERSON?
>> THAT IS EASIER -- SOME CITIES HAVE A DEC READING.
THE PROBLEM WITH THAT YOU HAVE TO BE CERT THE DECIBEL READINGS TO TAKE THE MEASUREMENTS.
MOST PHASES PHASED THEM OUT FOR THE REASON STANDARD.
REASONABLE OFFICER STANDING 50 FEET FROM THE PROPERTY IF IT'S LOUD OR OBNOXIOUS IT WOULD BE A VIOLATION.
THEY WOULD HAVE TO ARTICULATE THAT ON TH CITATION IN THEIR REPORT.
>> THAT IS MORE LEGALLY DEFENSIBLE.
WHEN YOU LOOK AT THE NOISE ORDINANCE THAN THE METER READER.
THE DIFFERENTIATION BETWEEN NOISE IN A REGULAR HOME VERSUS NOISE IN A SHORT-TERM RENTAL IS BECAUSE THEY HAVE A PERMIT FOR THE USE HOME AS A SHORT-TERM RENTAL, THEN WE CAN IMPOSE DIFFERENT NOISE STANDARDS.
>> I CONCUR WITH THE RAISING OF THE FEES.
I AGREE WITH LUPE IF WE CAN PHASE IT IN SOMEHOW.
IF WE HAVE TO PAY FOR THE NEW POSITIONS COVER THEM.
IF WE ARE TALKING ALREADY ABOUT PAYING FOR SOME OF THE SHORT-TERM RENTALS AND NOT COVERING THE COST.
IT DOESN'T MAKE MUCH SENSE TO ADD THREE OR FOUR MORE PEOPLE ON TOP OF IT AND PAY FOR THAT ON TOP OF IT, TOO.
I THINK WE HAVE BEEN BEHIND FOR A WHILE.
WE NEED TO DO A GOOD COMMUNICATION CAMPAIGN ON ALL OF THIS FROM NOISE TO FINES, THAT WE ARE NOT OUT OF THE SHORT-TERM BUSINESS RENTAL BUSINESS, BUT WE ARE
[02:20:01]
GOING TO WATCH IT AND MAKE SURE IT DOESN'T AFFECT THE QUALITY OF LIFE FOR THE RESIDENTS AND PEOPLE DON'T ACCUSE IT FOR COMING HERE.YOU ARE WELCOME BUT YOU NEED TO FOLLOW THE RULES.
IF NOT, THIS IS WHAT IS GOING TO HAPPEN.
WE ARE GOING TO GET SOME PUSHBACK AT THE VERY START BUT I THINK IF WE COMMUNICATE THAT AND START TO SEND OUT EVEN TO THE SHORT-TERM RENTAL PEOPLE THAT HAVE IT NOW AND THE H.O.A.S THE THIN FEES WILL BE DOING AND GIVE US YOUR INPUT WE GOOD INPUT FROM THE RESIDENTS AND THE SHORT-TERM RENTALS.
THAT IS HOW I STARTED TODAY WAS TO SAY WE FOR WAYS TO SAVE OUR INDUSTRY IN THIS ALL THE COMPLAINTS THAT WE GET.
WE ARE JUST TRYING TO GET PEOPLE TO DEAL WI ABUSES.
I THINK THE CHANGES THE COUNCIL MADE SOFTE CONSIDERABLY AND WILL BE LESS ONEROUS TO PEOPLE.
>> MARK, MAYBE WE CAN THEN DISCUSS THE COUNCIL NEXT STEPS IN TERMS OF WHETHER IT WOULD BE BRING BACKING DRAFT LANGUAGE, TAKING O TERMS OF HOW TO APPROACH THE BIG DISCUSSION WE HAD WITH LARGER PROPERTIES AND SPECIAL EVENTS, OCCUPANCY.
I KNOW WE INTERNALLY DISCUSS GETTING NOTICES OUT TO THE SHORT-TERM RENTAL COMMUNITY TO LET THEM KNOW WHAT IS HAPPENING PURPOSEF GET IN FRONT OF THAT TO HAVE A MORE ROBUST DISCUSSION.
I THINK THE EXPECTATION WOULD BE NOT TO ADO ANOTHER SESSION LIKE THIS WITH ACTUAL LANGUAGE AND OPTIONS FOR ALL OF YOU TO DISCUSS.
>> WITH THE INPUTS WE HAVE TO BE ABLE TO CH THERE IS SOMETHING WE NEED.
BY THAT TIME WE SHOULD HAVE THE SHORT-TERM RENTAL WEIGHED IN AND THE BUILDERS AND THE RESIDENTS AND THE H.O.A.S TO BE HONEST.
>> H.O.A.S MIGHT WANT TO PARTICIPATE IF THERE IS RULES AND REGULATIONS IN PLACE.
>> WE'LL GET IT ON THE CALENDAR.
SO I'M GOING TO ADJOURN THIS MEETING AND WE WILL ROLL RIGHT BACK IN THE NEXT ONE.
[GAVEL] WE'LL ADJOUR STUDY SESSION AT 5:24.
* This transcript was compiled from uncorrected Closed Captioning.